4 ms·

We just opened up the Canadian market.

1over137 8y ago
(Not sure who 'we' is but,) in the recent renegotiation of NAFTA, Canada did surrender some additional access to their domestic dairy market. The USA was demanding 100% access, but got only a couple of % more. But CETA, CPTPP, and USMCA combined get only 10% total of the total Canadian market. Basically, Canada prefers to have its supply management system, and the USA prefers have its massive subsidies.
- BareNakedCoder 8y ago
  Canadian here. Although my personal politics tends to be CENTRE-right (note the capitalization) and favouring market forces, I do see some merit in supply management to avoid the extreme pain being experienced by the American dairy farmers mentioned in the article. Yes, we mostly do prefer supply management, paid for by dairy consumers, than massive subsidies, paid for by all taxpayers and leading to wasted output. For details, read Wikipedia [0]. Some quotes: - High (tariffs) are only placed on imports above the quota, not on all the dairy products sold to Canada. - Canada's milk quota system is butterfat-based so the highest TRQ is on butter at 298.5%. - By 2018 the United States's quantitative (tariff) threshold for the import of milk products is 3% and Canada's is 10%. - designed to prevent shortages and surpluses, to ensure farmers a fair rate of return and Canadian consumer access to a high-quality, stable, and secure supply of these sensitive products. Mr T, in his incendiary speeches to his tribe, was selective with his facts. The 300% tariff does not apply to all dairy; only butter and only when exceeding USA's quota (Canadian farmers who exceed their quota cannot sell at all). The threats and beatings delivered by Mr T's negotiators did "open up" the Canadian dairy market a little, but supply management is still intact and "diversification" is now on the minds of many Canadians. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_management_(Canada) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_management_(Canada)
  - pcc 8y ago
    As a sidebar, the US has its own 'supply management'-style policies in place for markets like sugar, where Canada's access was limited to 0.1% of the market, pre-USMCA. [0] I wonder what will end having greater economic impact in the long run: the relatively minor 'tweaks' USMCA makes in these markets, or the extent to which Mr T has shaken the foundations of Canadians' relationship with the US. [0] https://business.financialpost.com/commodities/agriculture/forget-canadas-dairy-producers-the-u-s-sugar-cartel-has-an-even-sweeter-deal-from-its-government https://business.financialpost.com/commodities/agriculture/f...
- ars 8y ago
  > and the USA prefers have its massive subsidies. There are no dairy subsidies in the US right now.

(Not sure who 'we' is but,) in the recent renegotiation of NAFTA, Canada did surrender some additional access to their domestic dairy market. The USA was demanding 100% access, but got only a couple of % more. But CETA, CPTPP, and USMCA combined get only 10% total of the total Canadian market. Basically, Canada prefers to have its supply management system, and the USA prefers have its massive subsidies.

BareNakedCoder 8y ago
Canadian here. Although my personal politics tends to be CENTRE-right (note the capitalization) and favouring market forces, I do see some merit in supply management to avoid the extreme pain being experienced by the American dairy farmers mentioned in the article. Yes, we mostly do prefer supply management, paid for by dairy consumers, than massive subsidies, paid for by all taxpayers and leading to wasted output. For details, read Wikipedia [0]. Some quotes: - High (tariffs) are only placed on imports above the quota, not on all the dairy products sold to Canada. - Canada's milk quota system is butterfat-based so the highest TRQ is on butter at 298.5%. - By 2018 the United States's quantitative (tariff) threshold for the import of milk products is 3% and Canada's is 10%. - designed to prevent shortages and surpluses, to ensure farmers a fair rate of return and Canadian consumer access to a high-quality, stable, and secure supply of these sensitive products. Mr T, in his incendiary speeches to his tribe, was selective with his facts. The 300% tariff does not apply to all dairy; only butter and only when exceeding USA's quota (Canadian farmers who exceed their quota cannot sell at all). The threats and beatings delivered by Mr T's negotiators did "open up" the Canadian dairy market a little, but supply management is still intact and "diversification" is now on the minds of many Canadians. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_management_(Canada) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_management_(Canada)
- pcc 8y ago
  As a sidebar, the US has its own 'supply management'-style policies in place for markets like sugar, where Canada's access was limited to 0.1% of the market, pre-USMCA. [0] I wonder what will end having greater economic impact in the long run: the relatively minor 'tweaks' USMCA makes in these markets, or the extent to which Mr T has shaken the foundations of Canadians' relationship with the US. [0] https://business.financialpost.com/commodities/agriculture/forget-canadas-dairy-producers-the-u-s-sugar-cartel-has-an-even-sweeter-deal-from-its-government https://business.financialpost.com/commodities/agriculture/f...
ars 8y ago
> and the USA prefers have its massive subsidies. There are no dairy subsidies in the US right now.