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> The level of victimization they felt was immense, like they had no choice but to sign on the dotted line We give children close to zero financial autonomy, n

> The level of victimization they felt was immense, like they had no choice but to sign on the dotted line We give children close to zero financial autonomy, no idea of work, of making money and losing it, then ask them to make one of the largest financial decisions of their lives at the age of 18. The background to this is a massive amount of messaging that your education is worth it. It's not surprising they feel this way. For the record, I didn't go the traditional college route, and I never had a penny of student debt, so if anyone has a right to feel smugly superior, it'd be me. However, I only avoided student debt by the dumb luck of making poorly thought out decisions that happened to work out in the end.

the_jeremy 8y ago
I agree. I only avoided student debt because I originally thought that I was going to get a doctorate, so it didn't matter if I went to a no-name state school with a good scholarship. I chose my path arbitrarily based on classes that were reasonably interesting in high school (which means I didn't even consider a large percentage of majors), and kind of expected things to "work out". I got one degree (econ) after 3 years and ditched, and then couldn't get a job and realized that a doctorate wasn't for me. The second time around, I made way better choices, I was far more proactive about my education and internships, I chose a degree that fit me much better and was more financially appealing, and switched to another state school to maintain lower costs. I lucked into my situation, too. If someone tried to tell me at 18 the lessons I'd later learn, I'm not sure I'd have listened.
sanderjd 8y ago
Yep, my perspective on this has long been that all the important positive adult influencers in many adolescents' lives are telling them things like: 1. Don't do drugs, 2. Practice safe sex or abstain, 3. Be honest and kind, 4. Work hard, 5. Go to college, and 6. It's worth incurring debt to do that. Then a few years later, it's "victimization" if you happened to do all the things the adults told you to do. The expectation seems to be that teenagers figure out for themselves which advice from adults is good and which is bad.
franciscrick1 8y ago
Can an entire society perpetuate itself given that all members always make empirically bad decisions that work out in the end?

the_jeremy 8y ago

I agree. I only avoided student debt because I originally thought that I was going to get a doctorate, so it didn't matter if I went to a no-name state school with a good scholarship. I chose my path arbitrarily based on classes that were reasonably interesting in high school (which means I didn't even consider a large percentage of majors), and kind of expected things to "work out". I got one degree (econ) after 3 years and ditched, and then couldn't get a job and realized that a doctorate wasn't for me. The second time around, I made way better choices, I was far more proactive about my education and internships, I chose a degree that fit me much better and was more financially appealing, and switched to another state school to maintain lower costs. I lucked into my situation, too. If someone tried to tell me at 18 the lessons I'd later learn, I'm not sure I'd have listened.

sanderjd 8y ago

Yep, my perspective on this has long been that all the important positive adult influencers in many adolescents' lives are telling them things like: 1. Don't do drugs, 2. Practice safe sex or abstain, 3. Be honest and kind, 4. Work hard, 5. Go to college, and 6. It's worth incurring debt to do that. Then a few years later, it's "victimization" if you happened to do all the things the adults told you to do. The expectation seems to be that teenagers figure out for themselves which advice from adults is good and which is bad.

franciscrick1 8y ago

Can an entire society perpetuate itself given that all members always make empirically bad decisions that work out in the end?