5 ms·

> BYU. Current tuition is $5,620 for full-time semesters - it was about half that when I started 10 years ago. Which indicates a huge part of the problem for a

> BYU. Current tuition is $5,620 for full-time semesters - it was about half that when I started 10 years ago. Which indicates a huge part of the problem for a lot of people these days. It's a safe bet that the wages at the jobs you worked then haven't doubled in the last ten years, so someone merely wanting to replicate your path would need to work considerably more hours just to make their tuition payments. Reliable, accredited colleges cheap enough that you can realistically work your way through them at the wages paid at the kinds of jobs typically open to inexperienced students are increasingly thin on the ground.

leetcrew 8y ago
idk whether this is the case at BYU specifically, but in-state tuition at most state universities is going to be about that much per semester, and there are going to be many different grants available to a person who has no assets and a minimum wage job. any loans you end up taking in this position will have highly favorable terms subsidized by the us government.
- OldJackHinson 8y ago
  > any loans you end up taking in this position will have highly favorable terms subsidized by the us government. Except for the fact that they are almost completely non-dischargeable, you mean.
  - leetcrew 8y ago
    yes they are nondischargeable in most cases, but good luck finding a private unsecured loan at anywhere near as low as the interest rate on a subsidized Stafford loan.
TallGuyShort 8y ago
Yeah - costs are absolutely rising out of control, and I think the loan situation is a massive part of the problem. If your demand is fixed and people can forget about the costs until you've already been paid, why not raise prices? But I heard the same complaints back then from many of my peers, all that I know of are still in debt, and many got financial aid and misspent it. There's definitely a chronic and widespread problem of people not confronting the costs / benefits and deciding to seriously invest hard work and critical thinking into avoiding debt. If people can't do it at $2000 / semester in a very low-cost town, attending most major universities is just not even an option I'd recommend my kids even consider.
- johnminter 8y ago
  I agree. Too many students and their parents seem to engage in wishful thinking about college and not do due diligence when considering the costs. The schools have a financial conflict of interest: they get paid whether or not the student succeeds. Here are some conversations to start the process: 1) Does the student have a history of completing what they start? If not, consider a part-time trial at a community college with expectation of finishing with decent grades in courses that will transfer. 2) Will the student need remedial classes? The school gets paid but these courses do not satisfy graduation requirements. They do increase debt! 3) Does the student have a clear goal for a major? College is an expensive place to "find yourself." 4) What are the job prospects for that degree? How likely is it that the student will be high in the distribution of the graduates? Will the anticipated salary permit repayment of debt and self-support? 5) Are the time-to-graduate estimates realistic? A surprisingly low percentage of students complete a degree in 4 years. 5-6 is more common and results in more debt... 6) Has the student learned to live within budget? There are many distractions at college. Spring Break trips add cost...
awat 8y ago
Also to be fair $5,620 appears to be the tuition for LDS church members which likely means it's being subsidized. It looks like it's double for non-LDS students. https://financialaid.byu.edu/cost-of-attendance https://financialaid.byu.edu/cost-of-attendance
- TallGuyShort 8y ago
  That page is annual, assuming you do full-time Fall / Winter and don't take classes during the summer. My numbers are per full-time semester, which is typically how tuition prices are listed (and how they are elsewhere on the website).

leetcrew 8y ago

idk whether this is the case at BYU specifically, but in-state tuition at most state universities is going to be about that much per semester, and there are going to be many different grants available to a person who has no assets and a minimum wage job. any loans you end up taking in this position will have highly favorable terms subsidized by the us government.

OldJackHinson 8y ago
> any loans you end up taking in this position will have highly favorable terms subsidized by the us government. Except for the fact that they are almost completely non-dischargeable, you mean.
- leetcrew 8y ago
  yes they are nondischargeable in most cases, but good luck finding a private unsecured loan at anywhere near as low as the interest rate on a subsidized Stafford loan.

TallGuyShort 8y ago

Yeah - costs are absolutely rising out of control, and I think the loan situation is a massive part of the problem. If your demand is fixed and people can forget about the costs until you've already been paid, why not raise prices? But I heard the same complaints back then from many of my peers, all that I know of are still in debt, and many got financial aid and misspent it. There's definitely a chronic and widespread problem of people not confronting the costs / benefits and deciding to seriously invest hard work and critical thinking into avoiding debt. If people can't do it at $2000 / semester in a very low-cost town, attending most major universities is just not even an option I'd recommend my kids even consider.

johnminter 8y ago
I agree. Too many students and their parents seem to engage in wishful thinking about college and not do due diligence when considering the costs. The schools have a financial conflict of interest: they get paid whether or not the student succeeds. Here are some conversations to start the process: 1) Does the student have a history of completing what they start? If not, consider a part-time trial at a community college with expectation of finishing with decent grades in courses that will transfer. 2) Will the student need remedial classes? The school gets paid but these courses do not satisfy graduation requirements. They do increase debt! 3) Does the student have a clear goal for a major? College is an expensive place to "find yourself." 4) What are the job prospects for that degree? How likely is it that the student will be high in the distribution of the graduates? Will the anticipated salary permit repayment of debt and self-support? 5) Are the time-to-graduate estimates realistic? A surprisingly low percentage of students complete a degree in 4 years. 5-6 is more common and results in more debt... 6) Has the student learned to live within budget? There are many distractions at college. Spring Break trips add cost...

awat 8y ago

Also to be fair $5,620 appears to be the tuition for LDS church members which likely means it's being subsidized. It looks like it's double for non-LDS students. https://financialaid.byu.edu/cost-of-attendance https://financialaid.byu.edu/cost-of-attendance

TallGuyShort 8y ago
That page is annual, assuming you do full-time Fall / Winter and don't take classes during the summer. My numbers are per full-time semester, which is typically how tuition prices are listed (and how they are elsewhere on the website).