7 ms·

Does anyone else think this is really cool? This makes me think even more that Apple is really a supporter of privacy and a good actor. What do you think?

kerng 8y ago
Google and even Facebook have had this for quite some time. So nothing new here - it's a GDPR requirement.
- masklinn 8y ago
  > Google, Microsoft and even Facebook have had this for quite some time. Deployed and available outside the EU, and more specifically in the US?
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - confutio 8y ago
    Google Takeout has been available for years: https://takeout.google.com/settings/takeout?pli=1 https://takeout.google.com/settings/takeout?pli=1
  - radicaldreamer 8y ago
    Yes (at least for Google and Facebook)? I think the types of content differ between regions (EU includes some legally mandated data in addition to the standard set) but user created content is definitely available for download in all regions.
  - kerng 8y ago
    Yes, not just US and EU - for everyone.
  - nyolfen 8y ago
    i downloaded my (US) fb data when i deleted i 2014; it didnt have my social graph or anything but had all the content i posted
  - jkn 8y ago
    The Data Liberation Front team was formed at Google in 2007, and released Google Takeout in 2011, worldwide, well before the other big companies had anything similar in place. http://dataliberation.blogspot.com/2011/06/data-liberation-front-delivers-google.html http://dataliberation.blogspot.com/2011/06/data-liberation-f... For more up-to-date information see the Wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Data_Liberation_Front#cite_note-blogm-4 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Data_Liberation_Front#c... This service works quite well, I'm using it to backup the whole of my Google data every few months, including Gmail, Photos and Drive.
    - bunnycorn 8y ago
      It's different. Google Takeout was/is a nice user feature. Google is not required to pass all of user's data. GDPR compliance is different, companies are required to pass basically a database dump by law.
      - ehsankia 8y ago
        How is that relevant? If anything, that actually goes to show the point being made, which is that Google had this available everywhere before GDPR even existed. Most other companies, including Apple, are only doing this because they have to in Europe, whereas Google did it arguably for better reasons.
      - qwertay 8y ago
        The GDPR was wonderful. One of the websites I use had an export option but it only gave some of the data which didn't include the bit I wanted and then the GDPR came along and now I get a CSV dump of every table for my user.
    - FabHK 8y ago
      To be fair, Apple has for the longest time allowed export of contacts (.vcard), calendar items (.ics), photos (several formats), music (except for music purchased in the iTunes store for some time that was DRMd), mailboxes, etc. While I feel locked in to an extent because I don't want to give up macOS/iOS/watchOS and their integration, I never felt that my data was locked up with Apple.
  - zawerf 8y ago
    For google, if you don't like the format of Google Takeout (a huge dump of files without UI to browse it), you can also check out a live stream of all data they are collecting: https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity Or for specific products, you can figure out the demographic inferred for you on ads, or gps tracking for maps: https://www.google.com/settings/ads https://www.google.com/settings/ads https://www.google.com/maps/timeline https://www.google.com/maps/timeline
samschooler 8y ago
I agree that Apple is a support of privacy. But this by itself I don’t think indicates anything. Especially since Google and Facebook already have the same thing and they are definitely not supporters of privacy.
ilovecaching 8y ago
> This makes me think even more that Apple is really a supporter of privacy and a good actor. That's the point... this is a publicity stunt. Corporations don't have feelings, and the board that drives the company is primarily concerned with company health and growth above all other things. Leadership may, however, set a strategy that capitalizes on recent public scrutiny of user privacy concerns to push the narrative that will sell more iDevices. Humanizing corporations is a dangerous game, because it plays right into their hand. Don't let them fool you into it.
- baxtr 8y ago
  I believe that this is a very simplistic view. Of course corporations can’t have any feelings, but corporations are still led by human beings who can have truthful views and steer a company such that they do some good. I believe Tim Cook and most of his top managers have good intentions. At least they have been very consistent on some topics like privacy, minority rights and the environment. Is Apple perfect? Of course not. But I have not the feeling they need to do these things just for publicity reasons
  - ilovecaching 8y ago
    Corporations will do "good" things when it aligns with their product goals. You can be sure that if Tim Cook or anyone at a publicly traded company started steering a company away from profitability they would be replaced. The company will always be susceptible to market forces, and the needs of its shareholders and employees before users or the world, unless regulation steps in or public opinion would hurt their profitability.
    - ovao 8y ago
      While you make a fair point, the commenter is suggesting that Tim Cook is well-intentioned, and the comment that a company like Apple is suspectible to market forces is not an indication that Cook is not well-intentioned. (Not that intentions matter particularly either way.)
- eitland 8y ago
robdachshund 8y ago
So if I rob your house and show you what I stole I'm suddenly a good guy?
Yizahi 8y ago
Then they wouldn't degrade user security to the single point of failure - PIN code, in recent iOS versions.
- Karunamon 8y ago
  Usability and security are usually at opposite ends of the spectrum - and keep in mind that even a pin code + face/touch ID is infinitely better than the zero security most people had prior.
  - Yizahi 8y ago
    I was talking about better security that was present in iOS10 and then degraded by Apple in iOS11. See the link - https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-rise-and-fall-of-ios-security/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-r...
- bunnycorn 8y ago
  > PIN code Then write down your PIN code somewhere else, now you don't have a "single point of failure".
  - Yizahi 8y ago
    How is writing down PIN related to security? It is still a single point of failure, attacker knowing PIN can gain access to everything in your account - iCloud, password backups etc. And in iOS10 security was better, so Apple consciously decided to degrade it in iOS11. See source - https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-rise-and-fall-of-ios-security/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-r...
fatjokes 8y ago
Tinfoil hat: as others have already noted, Google and FB have had this feature for awhile (e.g., Google Takeout) but the media likes to hype up Apple vs. GoogFace as GoogFace are direct competitors of traditional media and have been responsible for their decline.
- xvector 8y ago
  It's not even a media thing. It's fact that Apple has always been more privacy-conscious than Google or Facebook. They didn't create the Secure Enclave for kicks, and they stand more to gain (financially) from inspecting your unencrypted data than your Enclave-encrypted data.
Ataraxy 8y ago
I think it's more so baffling this is only happening now (likely due to GDPR) considering how other big players have been doing this for quite some time. What I mean is it's innovation.
deelowe 8y ago
Isn't this being done for GDPR compliance? I think they are just making it available for all instead of trying to regionalize it.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
pndy 8y ago
Although I'm European I'd like to say that having only the way to download all harvested data and ability to correct the basic information provided like name, last name etc. is not enough. There should be also a way to request data purge on their servers - the descriptions of categories I saw when log in there aren't something I wish they would store and process - no matter how blurred or meaningless they are. That's still data about me and I believe I should have the control over it. Moreover, the purge request should be the industry standard (and that's what was missing in my opinion in GDPR) - even if it would take time to process the request, I would like to have such ability. The site introduced under www.apple.com/privacy/ address is from my PoV, of power user not something that I'm not aware - maybe it will be helpful to the masses but I don't find such "tips" useful at all. Overall tone of this page is no different than any other similar and says "trust us, we won't do bad things". Which sided with leaks, privacy breaches we had doesn't give me the positive vibes - despite of Apple approach to the privacy.
readhn 8y ago
The issue is that they ALSO still have your data, yes you have it now (hey, thanks for my own data) but they and god knows who else at this point have it and they really can do literally anything with it without your knowledge. What we really need is a TRUE DELETE FOREVER YOUR DATA with 0% chance of recovery by anyone. People want to be able to log into google, microsoft, apple etc. download and then delete accounts completely if they fee like it. My data, i own it, i should be able to take it out of the system forever. THAT we will never get. Why? Because customers personal data is gold and no one wants or will throw that away.

kerng 8y ago

Google and even Facebook have had this for quite some time. So nothing new here - it's a GDPR requirement.

masklinn 8y ago
> Google, Microsoft and even Facebook have had this for quite some time. Deployed and available outside the EU, and more specifically in the US?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- confutio 8y ago
  Google Takeout has been available for years: https://takeout.google.com/settings/takeout?pli=1 https://takeout.google.com/settings/takeout?pli=1
- radicaldreamer 8y ago
  Yes (at least for Google and Facebook)? I think the types of content differ between regions (EU includes some legally mandated data in addition to the standard set) but user created content is definitely available for download in all regions.
- kerng 8y ago
  Yes, not just US and EU - for everyone.
- nyolfen 8y ago
  i downloaded my (US) fb data when i deleted i 2014; it didnt have my social graph or anything but had all the content i posted
- jkn 8y ago
  The Data Liberation Front team was formed at Google in 2007, and released Google Takeout in 2011, worldwide, well before the other big companies had anything similar in place. http://dataliberation.blogspot.com/2011/06/data-liberation-front-delivers-google.html http://dataliberation.blogspot.com/2011/06/data-liberation-f... For more up-to-date information see the Wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Data_Liberation_Front#cite_note-blogm-4 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Data_Liberation_Front#c... This service works quite well, I'm using it to backup the whole of my Google data every few months, including Gmail, Photos and Drive.
  - bunnycorn 8y ago
    It's different. Google Takeout was/is a nice user feature. Google is not required to pass all of user's data. GDPR compliance is different, companies are required to pass basically a database dump by law.
    - ehsankia 8y ago
      How is that relevant? If anything, that actually goes to show the point being made, which is that Google had this available everywhere before GDPR even existed. Most other companies, including Apple, are only doing this because they have to in Europe, whereas Google did it arguably for better reasons.
    - qwertay 8y ago
      The GDPR was wonderful. One of the websites I use had an export option but it only gave some of the data which didn't include the bit I wanted and then the GDPR came along and now I get a CSV dump of every table for my user.
  - FabHK 8y ago
    To be fair, Apple has for the longest time allowed export of contacts (.vcard), calendar items (.ics), photos (several formats), music (except for music purchased in the iTunes store for some time that was DRMd), mailboxes, etc. While I feel locked in to an extent because I don't want to give up macOS/iOS/watchOS and their integration, I never felt that my data was locked up with Apple.
- zawerf 8y ago
  For google, if you don't like the format of Google Takeout (a huge dump of files without UI to browse it), you can also check out a live stream of all data they are collecting: https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity Or for specific products, you can figure out the demographic inferred for you on ads, or gps tracking for maps: https://www.google.com/settings/ads https://www.google.com/settings/ads https://www.google.com/maps/timeline https://www.google.com/maps/timeline

samschooler 8y ago

I agree that Apple is a support of privacy. But this by itself I don’t think indicates anything. Especially since Google and Facebook already have the same thing and they are definitely not supporters of privacy.

ilovecaching 8y ago

> This makes me think even more that Apple is really a supporter of privacy and a good actor. That's the point... this is a publicity stunt. Corporations don't have feelings, and the board that drives the company is primarily concerned with company health and growth above all other things. Leadership may, however, set a strategy that capitalizes on recent public scrutiny of user privacy concerns to push the narrative that will sell more iDevices. Humanizing corporations is a dangerous game, because it plays right into their hand. Don't let them fool you into it.

baxtr 8y ago
I believe that this is a very simplistic view. Of course corporations can’t have any feelings, but corporations are still led by human beings who can have truthful views and steer a company such that they do some good. I believe Tim Cook and most of his top managers have good intentions. At least they have been very consistent on some topics like privacy, minority rights and the environment. Is Apple perfect? Of course not. But I have not the feeling they need to do these things just for publicity reasons
- ilovecaching 8y ago
  Corporations will do "good" things when it aligns with their product goals. You can be sure that if Tim Cook or anyone at a publicly traded company started steering a company away from profitability they would be replaced. The company will always be susceptible to market forces, and the needs of its shareholders and employees before users or the world, unless regulation steps in or public opinion would hurt their profitability.
  - ovao 8y ago
    While you make a fair point, the commenter is suggesting that Tim Cook is well-intentioned, and the comment that a company like Apple is suspectible to market forces is not an indication that Cook is not well-intentioned. (Not that intentions matter particularly either way.)
eitland 8y ago

robdachshund 8y ago

So if I rob your house and show you what I stole I'm suddenly a good guy?

Yizahi 8y ago

Then they wouldn't degrade user security to the single point of failure - PIN code, in recent iOS versions.

Karunamon 8y ago
Usability and security are usually at opposite ends of the spectrum - and keep in mind that even a pin code + face/touch ID is infinitely better than the zero security most people had prior.
- Yizahi 8y ago
  I was talking about better security that was present in iOS10 and then degraded by Apple in iOS11. See the link - https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-rise-and-fall-of-ios-security/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-r...
bunnycorn 8y ago
> PIN code Then write down your PIN code somewhere else, now you don't have a "single point of failure".
- Yizahi 8y ago
  How is writing down PIN related to security? It is still a single point of failure, attacker knowing PIN can gain access to everything in your account - iCloud, password backups etc. And in iOS10 security was better, so Apple consciously decided to degrade it in iOS11. See source - https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-rise-and-fall-of-ios-security/ https://blog.elcomsoft.com/2017/11/ios-11-horror-story-the-r...

fatjokes 8y ago

Tinfoil hat: as others have already noted, Google and FB have had this feature for awhile (e.g., Google Takeout) but the media likes to hype up Apple vs. GoogFace as GoogFace are direct competitors of traditional media and have been responsible for their decline.

xvector 8y ago
It's not even a media thing. It's fact that Apple has always been more privacy-conscious than Google or Facebook. They didn't create the Secure Enclave for kicks, and they stand more to gain (financially) from inspecting your unencrypted data than your Enclave-encrypted data.

Ataraxy 8y ago

I think it's more so baffling this is only happening now (likely due to GDPR) considering how other big players have been doing this for quite some time. What I mean is it's innovation.

deelowe 8y ago

Isn't this being done for GDPR compliance? I think they are just making it available for all instead of trying to regionalize it.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

pndy 8y ago

Although I'm European I'd like to say that having only the way to download all harvested data and ability to correct the basic information provided like name, last name etc. is not enough. There should be also a way to request data purge on their servers - the descriptions of categories I saw when log in there aren't something I wish they would store and process - no matter how blurred or meaningless they are. That's still data about me and I believe I should have the control over it. Moreover, the purge request should be the industry standard (and that's what was missing in my opinion in GDPR) - even if it would take time to process the request, I would like to have such ability. The site introduced under www.apple.com/privacy/ address is from my PoV, of power user not something that I'm not aware - maybe it will be helpful to the masses but I don't find such "tips" useful at all. Overall tone of this page is no different than any other similar and says "trust us, we won't do bad things". Which sided with leaks, privacy breaches we had doesn't give me the positive vibes - despite of Apple approach to the privacy.

readhn 8y ago

The issue is that they ALSO still have your data, yes you have it now (hey, thanks for my own data) but they and god knows who else at this point have it and they really can do literally anything with it without your knowledge. What we really need is a TRUE DELETE FOREVER YOUR DATA with 0% chance of recovery by anyone. People want to be able to log into google, microsoft, apple etc. download and then delete accounts completely if they fee like it. My data, i own it, i should be able to take it out of the system forever. THAT we will never get. Why? Because customers personal data is gold and no one wants or will throw that away.