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Some Electric Car Drivers Might Spew More CO2 Than Diesel Cars

tardigras 8y ago
There are a lot of caveats here that this click-baity headline doesn't convey: They COULD create more CO2 "if it’s made in a factory powered by fossil fuels in a place like Germany, according to Berylls’ findings." That's a big assumption and one that doesn't account for the long-term impact that electric vehicles could have on the road. Also, the overall impact of the CO2 emissions depends on where the car is being driven and where the factory is located. Also this: “'It will come down to where is the battery made, how is it made, and even where do we get our electric power from,' said Henrik Fisker, chief executive officer and chairman of Fisker Inc., a California-based developer of electric vehicles."
dv_dt 8y ago
This trope again. Yes if you manufacture cars using dirty energy, then the operational payback is on a different starting basis. But the operational CO2 is almost always lower for electric cars. And where it's not, the progress of national infrastructures may flip that during the life of the electric car anyway. What's not discussed: as the market grows for electric cars, then the market grows for batteries, which then feeds into reduced battery costs, increasing access of battery tech for electric infrastructure markets. Electric cars are good for the future in that way. Yet this article makes it a question of what vehicle tech to choose, instead of a question of what infrastructure and factory investments to choose. I think my outlook on this is that environment concious consumers should choose electric cars based not only on the vehicle, but also on the decisions their makers elect in their supply chain.
artificialidiot 8y ago
While we are calculating the externalised costs, why not include the considerable health care impact of the exhaust gasses on the populace? I'd welcome the reduced personal costs, if electric vehicle adoption is much more: * My immune system would work much better without having to deal with all the pollution so I wouldn't get sick as often. * I would be able to commute work by bike if I wouldn't have to inhale that much smoke during such an intensely aerobic activity. I wouldn't need public transport that much either. * I wouldn't have to consume fuel (or charge for that matter) when there is a jam. * I would feel and think much better if I don't have blood full of CO. Less reason for costly vices that forces me to feel only slightly better. If I have to put a figure, I estimate ~$150 monthly savings minimum for my current lifestyle which is nothing to sneeze at personally.
WorldMaker 8y ago
Because supply chain externalities are fair game when evaluating electric cars but somehow diesel cars are magically grown in forests without factories building them and diesel itself is fairy power source that flows from magic fountains? It's amazing how many of these articles talk about the "dirty factories" or "dirty electricity" of electric vehicles, but just happen ignore that diesel and gas cars come from the same factories, and just happen to stop follow supply chains at gas pump, as if the complex, carbon-heavy supply chains for extraction, refining, and shipping oil/gas/diesel to gas pumps don't make even the most noxious, mountain destroying, coal-powered electricity look like a wonder of efficiency and green energy.

There are a lot of caveats here that this click-baity headline doesn't convey: They COULD create more CO2 "if it’s made in a factory powered by fossil fuels in a place like Germany, according to Berylls’ findings." That's a big assumption and one that doesn't account for the long-term impact that electric vehicles could have on the road. Also, the overall impact of the CO2 emissions depends on where the car is being driven and where the factory is located. Also this: “'It will come down to where is the battery made, how is it made, and even where do we get our electric power from,' said Henrik Fisker, chief executive officer and chairman of Fisker Inc., a California-based developer of electric vehicles."

dv_dt 8y ago

This trope again. Yes if you manufacture cars using dirty energy, then the operational payback is on a different starting basis. But the operational CO2 is almost always lower for electric cars. And where it's not, the progress of national infrastructures may flip that during the life of the electric car anyway. What's not discussed: as the market grows for electric cars, then the market grows for batteries, which then feeds into reduced battery costs, increasing access of battery tech for electric infrastructure markets. Electric cars are good for the future in that way. Yet this article makes it a question of what vehicle tech to choose, instead of a question of what infrastructure and factory investments to choose. I think my outlook on this is that environment concious consumers should choose electric cars based not only on the vehicle, but also on the decisions their makers elect in their supply chain.

artificialidiot 8y ago

While we are calculating the externalised costs, why not include the considerable health care impact of the exhaust gasses on the populace? I'd welcome the reduced personal costs, if electric vehicle adoption is much more: * My immune system would work much better without having to deal with all the pollution so I wouldn't get sick as often. * I would be able to commute work by bike if I wouldn't have to inhale that much smoke during such an intensely aerobic activity. I wouldn't need public transport that much either. * I wouldn't have to consume fuel (or charge for that matter) when there is a jam. * I would feel and think much better if I don't have blood full of CO. Less reason for costly vices that forces me to feel only slightly better. If I have to put a figure, I estimate ~$150 monthly savings minimum for my current lifestyle which is nothing to sneeze at personally.

WorldMaker 8y ago

Because supply chain externalities are fair game when evaluating electric cars but somehow diesel cars are magically grown in forests without factories building them and diesel itself is fairy power source that flows from magic fountains? It's amazing how many of these articles talk about the "dirty factories" or "dirty electricity" of electric vehicles, but just happen ignore that diesel and gas cars come from the same factories, and just happen to stop follow supply chains at gas pump, as if the complex, carbon-heavy supply chains for extraction, refining, and shipping oil/gas/diesel to gas pumps don't make even the most noxious, mountain destroying, coal-powered electricity look like a wonder of efficiency and green energy.