5 ms·

It is interesting to consider what we could be spending our money on instead of tax cuts for the wealthy and war: "Make public colleges and universities tuitio

It is interesting to consider what we could be spending our money on instead of tax cuts for the wealthy and war: "Make public colleges and universities tuition-free for working families, cut student loan interest rates in half, and allow every American with student debt to refinance at the lowest interest rate possible. Estimated cost: $60 billion." https://www.budget.senate.gov/ranking-member/newsroom/press/report-if-not-for-republican-policies-the-federal-government-would-be-running-a-surplus https://www.budget.senate.gov/ranking-member/newsroom/press/...

gowld 8y ago
There are 20million college students/yr. $3K/yr/capita seems an underestimate of the cost of their education, since high school costs >$5K/yr/capita.
- black6 8y ago
  You are correct. Resident tuition and fees at most[0] public[1] universities[2] trends[3] between[4] $4000-5000 per semester. 0: https://irep.olemiss.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/98/2017/09/Section-G-Annual-Expenses-2016-17.pdf https://irep.olemiss.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/98/2017/09... 1: https://utexas.app.box.com/v/CDS2016 https://utexas.app.box.com/v/CDS2016 2: http://ir.uoregon.edu/sites/ir.uoregon.edu/files/CDS_2016-2017_final_for_web.pdf http://ir.uoregon.edu/sites/ir.uoregon.edu/files/CDS_2016-20... 3: http://www.ir.vt.edu/content/dam/ir_vt_edu/commondatasets/CDS_2015_G.xlsx http://www.ir.vt.edu/content/dam/ir_vt_edu/commondatasets/CD... 4: https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d15/tables/xls/tabn330.10.xls https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d15/tables/xls/tabn330.1...
- lkbm 8y ago
  Drop ~5% of those as non-citizens[0]. Drop ?% of those as not falling under "working class". Adjust $??? billion for existing in-state subsidies, since only marginal cost is relevant. Of course, add $??? billion when quantity demand explodes when price drops. [0] https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2018/02/01/number-foreign-students-studying-drops/JHb6P59y3Ut0px2VM54JBN/story.html https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2018/02/01/number-foreign-...
JumpCrisscross 8y ago
> allow every American with student debt to refinance at the lowest interest rate possible Isn’t this always the case? The radical element is making tuirtion free and cutting rates in half. For the former, that involves states raising taxes or cutting other spending. For the latter, it involves the federal government further exposing itself to these debts. Making private loans payable at a fixed rate or fraction of AGI would be better. It would force lenders to give a shit about students’ post-graduation odds.
- paulpauper 8y ago
  More rigorous lending standards and or free tuition for students who qualify by having a certain minimum IQ and or SAT score, would help reduce debt and dropouts , but would be perceived as unfair and discriminatory against low-scoring groups
  - Teknoman117 8y ago
    Something felt very wrong when my little sister, who graduated with a 4.5 GPA from a competitive high school (completed nearly a dozen AP courses with ease), was unable to qualify for any academic scholarships because no one wants to give academic scholarships to non-minorities anymore. I mean, it’s not like I have direct proof, but for a girl who has placed top of her class, placed high in the national scholastic art and writing awards, was the newsletter editor for an astronomical society in high school, and is going into astrophysics at a top university, none of the dozens of academic scholarships she applied to would accept her? Something seems very fishy to me...
ptero 8y ago
That sounds well and good, but I am afraid will just lead to extending bureaucracy of K-12 education (on average horrible quality, outrageously expensive to the taxpayer) to universities. US has generally good universities (expensive, but good) precisely because public schools have to compete with private ones on quality and private ones must compete with public ones on cost. Take that competition away (and this proposal will wipe out private universities) and the quality will quickly suffer. I would much rather gov't required uniform transparency for all accredited public and private schools: acceptance rates; total sticker price, median actuals after scholarchips (so you can compare your "20k scholarship/65k tuition" package to averages); graduation rates; average debt at graduation; first and expected 10-year earnings; etc. Inform, not restrict. My 2c.
pc86 8y ago
Are you really posting a political press release that starts "If Not for Republican..." as a source?
- dlp211 8y ago
  Don't attack the source, debate the content.
chongli 8y ago
I'd like to know how they came to that estimate. Are they just taking the sum of all tuition currently being paid by eligible families? Or are they taking into account all the people who never bothered applying for college because they knew they'd never be able to afford it? Furthermore, the easier they make it to get into college financially, the harder it'll be academically. That shift in burden will lead to more stringent admissions requirements, which means people will have to pay more for SAT prep, tutoring, etc.

gowld 8y ago

There are 20million college students/yr. $3K/yr/capita seems an underestimate of the cost of their education, since high school costs >$5K/yr/capita.

black6 8y ago
You are correct. Resident tuition and fees at most[0] public[1] universities[2] trends[3] between[4] $4000-5000 per semester. 0: https://irep.olemiss.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/98/2017/09/Section-G-Annual-Expenses-2016-17.pdf https://irep.olemiss.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/98/2017/09... 1: https://utexas.app.box.com/v/CDS2016 https://utexas.app.box.com/v/CDS2016 2: http://ir.uoregon.edu/sites/ir.uoregon.edu/files/CDS_2016-2017_final_for_web.pdf http://ir.uoregon.edu/sites/ir.uoregon.edu/files/CDS_2016-20... 3: http://www.ir.vt.edu/content/dam/ir_vt_edu/commondatasets/CDS_2015_G.xlsx http://www.ir.vt.edu/content/dam/ir_vt_edu/commondatasets/CD... 4: https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d15/tables/xls/tabn330.10.xls https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d15/tables/xls/tabn330.1...
lkbm 8y ago
Drop ~5% of those as non-citizens[0]. Drop ?% of those as not falling under "working class". Adjust $??? billion for existing in-state subsidies, since only marginal cost is relevant. Of course, add $??? billion when quantity demand explodes when price drops. [0] https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2018/02/01/number-foreign-students-studying-drops/JHb6P59y3Ut0px2VM54JBN/story.html https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2018/02/01/number-foreign-...

JumpCrisscross 8y ago

> allow every American with student debt to refinance at the lowest interest rate possible Isn’t this always the case? The radical element is making tuirtion free and cutting rates in half. For the former, that involves states raising taxes or cutting other spending. For the latter, it involves the federal government further exposing itself to these debts. Making private loans payable at a fixed rate or fraction of AGI would be better. It would force lenders to give a shit about students’ post-graduation odds.

paulpauper 8y ago
More rigorous lending standards and or free tuition for students who qualify by having a certain minimum IQ and or SAT score, would help reduce debt and dropouts , but would be perceived as unfair and discriminatory against low-scoring groups
- Teknoman117 8y ago
  Something felt very wrong when my little sister, who graduated with a 4.5 GPA from a competitive high school (completed nearly a dozen AP courses with ease), was unable to qualify for any academic scholarships because no one wants to give academic scholarships to non-minorities anymore. I mean, it’s not like I have direct proof, but for a girl who has placed top of her class, placed high in the national scholastic art and writing awards, was the newsletter editor for an astronomical society in high school, and is going into astrophysics at a top university, none of the dozens of academic scholarships she applied to would accept her? Something seems very fishy to me...

ptero 8y ago

That sounds well and good, but I am afraid will just lead to extending bureaucracy of K-12 education (on average horrible quality, outrageously expensive to the taxpayer) to universities. US has generally good universities (expensive, but good) precisely because public schools have to compete with private ones on quality and private ones must compete with public ones on cost. Take that competition away (and this proposal will wipe out private universities) and the quality will quickly suffer. I would much rather gov't required uniform transparency for all accredited public and private schools: acceptance rates; total sticker price, median actuals after scholarchips (so you can compare your "20k scholarship/65k tuition" package to averages); graduation rates; average debt at graduation; first and expected 10-year earnings; etc. Inform, not restrict. My 2c.

pc86 8y ago

Are you really posting a political press release that starts "If Not for Republican..." as a source?

dlp211 8y ago
Don't attack the source, debate the content.

chongli 8y ago

I'd like to know how they came to that estimate. Are they just taking the sum of all tuition currently being paid by eligible families? Or are they taking into account all the people who never bothered applying for college because they knew they'd never be able to afford it? Furthermore, the easier they make it to get into college financially, the harder it'll be academically. That shift in burden will lead to more stringent admissions requirements, which means people will have to pay more for SAT prep, tutoring, etc.