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> Why is it OK to have all our devices, etc. manufactured in China, but it's not OK for Google to offer services there? This is a great angle. I have no idea,

> Why is it OK to have all our devices, etc. manufactured in China, but it's not OK for Google to offer services there? This is a great angle. I have no idea, why there is such a huge disparity there, but I have three possible explanations: 1. People do not understand supply chain management (myself included). There is nothing inherently evil about employing people in a foreign country, and not many people are aware that cost of production is lower in China because of (sometimes) horrible working conditions. 2. Google branded itself on "Don't be evil". More or less everyone in western countries would agree that facilitating censorship on a massive scale for the benefit of government officials is "bad". 3. Hypocrisy. Our way of life depends on low wage labour (read: explotiation of the poor) in foreign countries. Our morals follow our wallet.

eeZah7Ux 8y ago
4. Global consumerism is built on global labor arbitrage (read: exploitation of the poor). People are somewhat aware it but politicians only care about large companies making big profits.
- undreren 8y ago
  How is this the fault of government?
  - eeZah7Ux 8y ago
    Of out 5 countries described as "communist", the US government flattened N. Korea, invaded Vietnam, embargoed Cuba and developed China into one of the biggest world economies and a techno-dictatorship. Clearly the US government has the power to decide the destiny of less powerful countries. Compared to that, setting up trade agreements with China to ensure human rights, worker safety, environment protection and so on is pretty doable.
jchb 8y ago
> Our way of life depends on low wage labour (read: exploitation of the poor) in foreign countries In some sense this is true, but manufacturing in China is not just about low wage labour. The lowest minimum wage in China is 12 RMB/hour. In the US the federal minimum wage is 7.25 USD/hour. Now, 12 RMB ≈ 1.75 USD, but considering purchasing power parity (1), 12 RMB * 3.506 ≈ 6 USD. The average factory worker wage in China is considerably higher than the minimum wage. In fact it is higher than in some eastern European countries. Of course the above doesn't tell the whole picture as we haven't looked at for example work and environmental safety. But the lower cost of manufacturing in China can only partly be attributed to lower wages. It also an effect of their industrial network clusters, supply of raw materials, and export subsidies. Adding to that, manufacturing in China is not just about cost, it is also about the immense scale of their manufacturing capabilities. If you need to churn out half a million iPhone X per day, where else can you get that capability? (1) Using 2017 value for China from https://data.oecd.org/conversion/purchasing-power-parities-ppp.htm https://data.oecd.org/conversion/purchasing-power-parities-p...

eeZah7Ux 8y ago

4. Global consumerism is built on global labor arbitrage (read: exploitation of the poor). People are somewhat aware it but politicians only care about large companies making big profits.

undreren 8y ago
How is this the fault of government?
- eeZah7Ux 8y ago
  Of out 5 countries described as "communist", the US government flattened N. Korea, invaded Vietnam, embargoed Cuba and developed China into one of the biggest world economies and a techno-dictatorship. Clearly the US government has the power to decide the destiny of less powerful countries. Compared to that, setting up trade agreements with China to ensure human rights, worker safety, environment protection and so on is pretty doable.

jchb 8y ago

> Our way of life depends on low wage labour (read: exploitation of the poor) in foreign countries In some sense this is true, but manufacturing in China is not just about low wage labour. The lowest minimum wage in China is 12 RMB/hour. In the US the federal minimum wage is 7.25 USD/hour. Now, 12 RMB ≈ 1.75 USD, but considering purchasing power parity (1), 12 RMB * 3.506 ≈ 6 USD. The average factory worker wage in China is considerably higher than the minimum wage. In fact it is higher than in some eastern European countries. Of course the above doesn't tell the whole picture as we haven't looked at for example work and environmental safety. But the lower cost of manufacturing in China can only partly be attributed to lower wages. It also an effect of their industrial network clusters, supply of raw materials, and export subsidies. Adding to that, manufacturing in China is not just about cost, it is also about the immense scale of their manufacturing capabilities. If you need to churn out half a million iPhone X per day, where else can you get that capability? (1) Using 2017 value for China from https://data.oecd.org/conversion/purchasing-power-parities-ppp.htm https://data.oecd.org/conversion/purchasing-power-parities-p...