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'We Were Working 100-Hour Weeks,' Red Dead Redemption 2 Head Writer Says

16 points by _fs 8y ago

internet555 8y ago
Over a video game? Why ?
- danso 8y ago
  Their last mainline title, Grand Theft Auto V, made $1 billion in three days [0], and much, much more over its lifetime, even ignoring its extremely profitable multiplayer mode (GTA Online). [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Theft_Auto_V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Theft_Auto_V
  - internet555 8y ago
    For who? I’m not working 100 hours to make some random guy millions
    - danso 8y ago
      You asked why would people work this hard over a "video game". Presumably, you don't work at Rockstar and aren't in a position to gain financially from them, but I don't think it should be too hard to understand how people could be convinced (right or wrong) to do a few "crunch" weeks when the deliverable has a hard deadline and huge revenue potential.
      - internet555 8y ago
        Idk seems like a waste
      - chrisbennet 8y ago
        “...when the deliverable has a hard deadline and huge revenue potential.” for other people Forget the lack of a big reward, the developers doing the crazy overtime are often going to get layed off when the game ships.
user68858788 8y ago
The headline seems to be misleading. Here's Dan Houser's response (lead writer). "There seems to be some confusion arising from my interview with Harold Goldberg. The point I was trying to make in the article was related to how the narrative and dialogue in the game was crafted, which was mostly what we talked about, not about the different processes of the wider team. After working on the game for seven years, the senior writing team, which consists of four people, Mike Unsworth, Rupert Humphries, Lazlow and myself, had, as we always do, three weeks of intense work when we wrapped everything up. Three weeks, not years. We have all worked together for at least 12 years now, and feel we need this to get everything finished. After so many years of getting things organized and ready on this project, we needed this to check and finalize everything. More importantly, we obviously don’t expect anyone else to work this way. Across the whole company, we have some senior people who work very hard purely because they’re passionate about a project, or their particular work, and we believe that passion shows in the games we release. But that additional effort is a choice, and we don’t ask or expect anyone to work anything like this. Lots of other senior people work in an entirely different way and are just as productive – I’m just not one of them! No one, senior or junior, is ever forced to work hard. I believe we go to great lengths to run a business that cares about its people, and to make the company a great place for them to work."
- Cpoll 8y ago
  > More importantly, we obviously don’t expect anyone else to work this way. Across the whole company, we have some senior people who work very hard purely because they’re passionate about a project, or their particular work, and we believe that passion shows in the games we release. But that additional effort is a choice, and we don’t ask or expect anyone to work anything like this. Lots of other senior people work in an entirely different way and are just as productive – I’m just not one of them! No one, senior or junior, is ever forced to work hard. I believe we go to great lengths to run a business that cares about its people, and to make the company a great place for them to work." This is bullshit. When you start lauding people for their passion, staying in late stops being just a choice. As long as people notice, it starts becoming a metric. I don't debate that there exists people where the dev process is fun and meaningful, but for most people it's a cost-benefit analysis at best and a form of self-harm at worst. If you really care about your employees, don't incentivize them to regularly work late. And call crunch for what it is, don't normalize it.
goombastic 8y ago
This is a terrible example to set. It's like taking a blow torch to a candle and boasting about the mess in the end. What's going wrong with the world's working hours? Add commute times to this and this is slavery.
- gnulinux 8y ago
  I don't understand how this is even possible? 100h/w means 14h per day every single day. If you work 8am to 10pm and your commute is 1 hour you'll be spending 7am to 11pm out. Let's say you're ok with 6h sleep every day, you still have 2h to do life. Ignore dinner, entertainment, sex, relaxing, chilling etc... When do these people take shower? Do laundry? Pay bills? Grocery shop? I don't understand. I'm not even questioning the human aspect, it literally seems impossible to me, unless they decided to hire someone who'll do their laundry etc and they take quick showers. Bizarre.
Paraesthetic 8y ago
I would say its not even worth it, but this is one of the few games I would say it was worth it for.

16 points by _fs 8y ago

internet555 8y ago

Over a video game? Why ?

danso 8y ago
Their last mainline title, Grand Theft Auto V, made $1 billion in three days [0], and much, much more over its lifetime, even ignoring its extremely profitable multiplayer mode (GTA Online). [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Theft_Auto_V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Theft_Auto_V
- internet555 8y ago
  For who? I’m not working 100 hours to make some random guy millions
  - danso 8y ago
    You asked why would people work this hard over a "video game". Presumably, you don't work at Rockstar and aren't in a position to gain financially from them, but I don't think it should be too hard to understand how people could be convinced (right or wrong) to do a few "crunch" weeks when the deliverable has a hard deadline and huge revenue potential.
    - internet555 8y ago
      Idk seems like a waste
    - chrisbennet 8y ago
      “...when the deliverable has a hard deadline and huge revenue potential.” for other people Forget the lack of a big reward, the developers doing the crazy overtime are often going to get layed off when the game ships.

user68858788 8y ago

The headline seems to be misleading. Here's Dan Houser's response (lead writer). "There seems to be some confusion arising from my interview with Harold Goldberg. The point I was trying to make in the article was related to how the narrative and dialogue in the game was crafted, which was mostly what we talked about, not about the different processes of the wider team. After working on the game for seven years, the senior writing team, which consists of four people, Mike Unsworth, Rupert Humphries, Lazlow and myself, had, as we always do, three weeks of intense work when we wrapped everything up. Three weeks, not years. We have all worked together for at least 12 years now, and feel we need this to get everything finished. After so many years of getting things organized and ready on this project, we needed this to check and finalize everything. More importantly, we obviously don’t expect anyone else to work this way. Across the whole company, we have some senior people who work very hard purely because they’re passionate about a project, or their particular work, and we believe that passion shows in the games we release. But that additional effort is a choice, and we don’t ask or expect anyone to work anything like this. Lots of other senior people work in an entirely different way and are just as productive – I’m just not one of them! No one, senior or junior, is ever forced to work hard. I believe we go to great lengths to run a business that cares about its people, and to make the company a great place for them to work."

Cpoll 8y ago
> More importantly, we obviously don’t expect anyone else to work this way. Across the whole company, we have some senior people who work very hard purely because they’re passionate about a project, or their particular work, and we believe that passion shows in the games we release. But that additional effort is a choice, and we don’t ask or expect anyone to work anything like this. Lots of other senior people work in an entirely different way and are just as productive – I’m just not one of them! No one, senior or junior, is ever forced to work hard. I believe we go to great lengths to run a business that cares about its people, and to make the company a great place for them to work." This is bullshit. When you start lauding people for their passion, staying in late stops being just a choice. As long as people notice, it starts becoming a metric. I don't debate that there exists people where the dev process is fun and meaningful, but for most people it's a cost-benefit analysis at best and a form of self-harm at worst. If you really care about your employees, don't incentivize them to regularly work late. And call crunch for what it is, don't normalize it.

goombastic 8y ago

This is a terrible example to set. It's like taking a blow torch to a candle and boasting about the mess in the end. What's going wrong with the world's working hours? Add commute times to this and this is slavery.

gnulinux 8y ago
I don't understand how this is even possible? 100h/w means 14h per day every single day. If you work 8am to 10pm and your commute is 1 hour you'll be spending 7am to 11pm out. Let's say you're ok with 6h sleep every day, you still have 2h to do life. Ignore dinner, entertainment, sex, relaxing, chilling etc... When do these people take shower? Do laundry? Pay bills? Grocery shop? I don't understand. I'm not even questioning the human aspect, it literally seems impossible to me, unless they decided to hire someone who'll do their laundry etc and they take quick showers. Bizarre.

Paraesthetic 8y ago

I would say its not even worth it, but this is one of the few games I would say it was worth it for.