5 ms·

PeerTube 1.0: A decentralized video hosting network, based on libre software

64 points by varal7 8y ago

gobengo 8y ago
Good media hosts with all the fixins like CDNs, multiple formats, etc. are much needed on the fediverse. And iirc this project has been ongoing for at least a year, maybe more than two, so this isn't a rushed 1.0. Kudos for the persistence and contribution. Another win for ActivityPub!
- corobo 8y ago
  I don't think it's possible due to issue #1229. I know I shouldn't judge a project by it's closed issues but honestly I think the issue closure here has branded PeerTube as forever small fry in my mind https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/issues/1229 https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/issues/1229
  - austinheap 8y ago
    Chocobozzz didn't say that PeerTube will never support load balancing, just that -- for the issue you linked -- load balancing the transcoding engine is not a priority for the core dev team/doesn't promote their top-line goals of decentralization. I'm sure they'd accept a well-written PR.
    - corobo 8y ago
      For context > Sorry but peertube does not support load balancing. If you plan to have many users, you should consider creating different instances (to promote decentralization). How I read this, whether correctly or not, was that it’s suggested you set up an entirely new server, new database, new domain, new storage (cluster?), etc instead of being able to grow out your one instance. So now any new users need to register and upload to server2.example.com because of “because decentralisation” It’s just not feasible for the mainstream. Please do correct me if I’m interpreting incorrectly
      - austinheap 8y ago
        > How I read this, whether correctly or not, was that it’s suggested you set up an entirely new server, new database, new domain, new storage (cluster?), etc instead of being able to grow out your one instance. I could see that interpretation. Personally, I read that as "if you need to load balance transcoding, that code won't be done by the core team (right now)". You can already use whatever Postgres/Redis/nginx setup you want, cluster/load-balance those how you desire, etc. Load balancing the transcoding engine for new uploads is simply a different beast. > So now any new users need to register and upload to server2.example.com because of “because decentralisation” The only scenario in which load balancing transcoding changes anything is if 1) a user is uploading videos to a specific instance and 2) that instance is busy transcoding videos that were uploaded previously. So if a user uploads a video to an instance where all the transcoding threads are already busy, it wouldn't be available until a thread freed up to transcode it. > Please do correct me if I’m interpreting incorrectly FWIW I'm not trying to put words in Chocobozzz's mouth, just my interpretation.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
KaoruAoiShiho 8y ago
Is this going to be the new youtube for piracy?
- prolikewh0a 8y ago
  Hopefully it becomes just the new Youtube.
- austinheap 8y ago
  Piracy, or other objectionable content, is not exclusive to P2P platforms. YouTube has moderation features and so does PeerTube. From the FAQ: Being free doesn’t mean being above the law! Each PeerTube hosting provider can decide on its own general conditions of use, abiding by their local laws. For example, in France, discriminatory content is prohibited and may be reported to the authorities. PeerTube allows users to report problematic videos, and each administrator must then apply its moderation in accordance with its terms and conditions and the law. The federation system, for its part, allows hosts to decide with whom they want to connect, depending on the types of content or the moderation policies of others.
fabricexpert 8y ago
I've been doing lots of research on video games and some other niche areas, it's staggering how much information is on YouTube and only on YouTube. There are millions of hours of super high quality user-generated content locked up in videos that can't be (or aren't) indexed properly, all of which are effectively owned and maintained by Google. The number of alternatives to youtube is approximately zero. No one wants to upload to a new platform because it's a lot of work and you don't get paid for it (once you hit a certain number of YT views you start getting paid and there's real incentive there, you can potentially get relatively wealthy from it). Perhaps peertube will be the solution, but I suspect we need something groundbreaking to conquer the monopoly here.
- nyxtom 8y ago
  Censorship seems to be the main driving force behind users looking at other platforms at the moment. That being said, unfortunately, without the ad model, there's minimal incentives for users to fully migrate to other platforms like Patreon (for instance). If any new platform that wants to come online and compete, it will have to integrate the ad-model to provide any kind of real incentives for the users.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    Patreon should become a supporter of PeerTube development when Youtube axes Patreon platform use entirely.
    - thecatspaw 8y ago
      why/how would youtube axe Patreon platform use?
      - toomuchtodo 8y ago
        Using Youtube for Patreon videos, generating costs for YT that don't have a revenue/monetization component. https://www.polygon.com/2017/9/28/16380186/youtube-patreon-demonetization-policy https://www.polygon.com/2017/9/28/16380186/youtube-patreon-d... https://mashable.com/2017/09/28/youtube-outside-links-partnership-program/ https://mashable.com/2017/09/28/youtube-outside-links-partne...
rfugger 8y ago
How do you search across all those instances?
- austinheap 8y ago
  IIRC You can search from any instance that's well-peered: https://instances.joinpeertube.org/instances https://instances.joinpeertube.org/instances
kodablah 8y ago
So close, but ug [0]. A worthy effort (one I might pursue myself) is a self contained binary (or installer if I have to) that runs on Windows, daemonizes/service-izes itself w/ built in web server, dyn DNS's itself or other NAT punch approach, etc. A laudable first step to be sure, but to decentralize we need to target desktops. Many have them at home and are willing to leave them on all day, especially content creators. And it needs to be as easy to setup and non-desktop-invasive as possible. So sqlite instead of postgres? In mem instead of redis? Built-in web server instead of nginx? Windows instead of not-Windows? UI instead of a bunch of scripts? Bandwidth concerns, now we can talk about the value of BT or similar, but lots of content has few enough users to leverage a home connection. Or we can meet in the middle, find a quality hosting reseller, and have a UI that internally deploys containers/content for them for a couple bucks a month. 0 - https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/blob/develop/support/doc/production.md https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/blob/develop/support/...
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  An omnibus Docker container is preferable, and could even be run from always-on home gateways and NAS devices instead of transient desktops. Targeting desktops natively (and the development effort required) would be a bucket of sadness, and IMHO, a waste of time.
tyfon 8y ago
I like this project in it's concept, but I could never get the server to run properly. I also have problems with the fact that the IPs of the watchers are publicly shared due to the nature of the beast (p2p sharing). I'd like something like this but where I could give the users the option of running directly off my server or p2p. Perhaps this is even possible and that I have not seen it yet. It would be awesome if I could run my own "pod" with my let's plays and have it federated throughout the network. Currently I use google but without any form of monetisation as it's a hobby and I don't want to burden people with adds. Knowing google though they probably show adds themselvs and/or penalise me in the search for not having the on.
thepra 8y ago
I was hopeful for something more normal user manageable, an .exe would've be nice :/
narrator 8y ago
So what does this do that bitchute.com or d.tube doesn't do?
sctb 8y ago
Discussions from the last few days: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18204410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18204410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18196255 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18196255
ajvs 8y ago
I prefer the DTube approach personally. It instead uses the Steem blockchain for text content so it doesn't have the issue that ActivityPub or other federation protocols have where it needs to bootstrap to the largest instances, which is in effect partial centralisation. Blockchain use also means that server costs are passively paid for due to block rewards which makes it scalable. Lastly content creators can get paid directly via cryptocurrency so it encourages much more content creation.
14 8y ago
With YouTube I have noticed more and more videos require "age verification" which means forced log in. Just turns me off to be honest. Because first of all, anyone can create an email address and sign up, including my teen kid. So no it is not an age verification but a tracking system. If I am at my moms or a friends and using YouTube I don't want to sign into their potentially compromised pc with my credentials(sadly no yubikey at this time). Plus my password is like 20 long and random generated so I have no chance of remembering it. So I get to these videos and I am blocked from watching it without putting in an effort so I clearly can be tracked. I wait for the day people ditch YouTube for peer tube and the few videos I have in mind to future create, will be straight to peer tube not YouTube. My motivations are to share my knowledge not make any money from it.
- TekMol 8y ago
  anyone can create an email address and sign up including my teen kid my password is like 20 long and random generated so I have no chance of remembering it. Solution: Ask your kid to set up a throwaway account for you. With an easy to remember password.
  - 14 8y ago
    That does not address the tracking I have a problem with so not exactly a solution. Every time I use that throw away account on any pc I become connected forever to that pc in many data points. Youtube is getting plenty of data even if I use a throw away account. I would need to make a new throw away account, from a different ip address each time I wanted to do as you describe to avoid tracking so sometimes I just don't bother with the video.
- Confiks 8y ago
  This doesn't address your main point, but you might appreciate an easy workaround for this problem: access the video at /embed/$videoid

64 points by varal7 8y ago

Good media hosts with all the fixins like CDNs, multiple formats, etc. are much needed on the fediverse. And iirc this project has been ongoing for at least a year, maybe more than two, so this isn't a rushed 1.0. Kudos for the persistence and contribution. Another win for ActivityPub!

corobo 8y ago
I don't think it's possible due to issue #1229. I know I shouldn't judge a project by it's closed issues but honestly I think the issue closure here has branded PeerTube as forever small fry in my mind https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/issues/1229 https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/issues/1229
- austinheap 8y ago
  Chocobozzz didn't say that PeerTube will never support load balancing, just that -- for the issue you linked -- load balancing the transcoding engine is not a priority for the core dev team/doesn't promote their top-line goals of decentralization. I'm sure they'd accept a well-written PR.
  - corobo 8y ago
    For context > Sorry but peertube does not support load balancing. If you plan to have many users, you should consider creating different instances (to promote decentralization). How I read this, whether correctly or not, was that it’s suggested you set up an entirely new server, new database, new domain, new storage (cluster?), etc instead of being able to grow out your one instance. So now any new users need to register and upload to server2.example.com because of “because decentralisation” It’s just not feasible for the mainstream. Please do correct me if I’m interpreting incorrectly
    - austinheap 8y ago
      > How I read this, whether correctly or not, was that it’s suggested you set up an entirely new server, new database, new domain, new storage (cluster?), etc instead of being able to grow out your one instance. I could see that interpretation. Personally, I read that as "if you need to load balance transcoding, that code won't be done by the core team (right now)". You can already use whatever Postgres/Redis/nginx setup you want, cluster/load-balance those how you desire, etc. Load balancing the transcoding engine for new uploads is simply a different beast. > So now any new users need to register and upload to server2.example.com because of “because decentralisation” The only scenario in which load balancing transcoding changes anything is if 1) a user is uploading videos to a specific instance and 2) that instance is busy transcoding videos that were uploaded previously. So if a user uploads a video to an instance where all the transcoding threads are already busy, it wouldn't be available until a thread freed up to transcode it. > Please do correct me if I’m interpreting incorrectly FWIW I'm not trying to put words in Chocobozzz's mouth, just my interpretation.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

KaoruAoiShiho 8y ago

Is this going to be the new youtube for piracy?

prolikewh0a 8y ago
Hopefully it becomes just the new Youtube.
austinheap 8y ago
Piracy, or other objectionable content, is not exclusive to P2P platforms. YouTube has moderation features and so does PeerTube. From the FAQ: Being free doesn’t mean being above the law! Each PeerTube hosting provider can decide on its own general conditions of use, abiding by their local laws. For example, in France, discriminatory content is prohibited and may be reported to the authorities. PeerTube allows users to report problematic videos, and each administrator must then apply its moderation in accordance with its terms and conditions and the law. The federation system, for its part, allows hosts to decide with whom they want to connect, depending on the types of content or the moderation policies of others.

fabricexpert 8y ago

I've been doing lots of research on video games and some other niche areas, it's staggering how much information is on YouTube and only on YouTube. There are millions of hours of super high quality user-generated content locked up in videos that can't be (or aren't) indexed properly, all of which are effectively owned and maintained by Google. The number of alternatives to youtube is approximately zero. No one wants to upload to a new platform because it's a lot of work and you don't get paid for it (once you hit a certain number of YT views you start getting paid and there's real incentive there, you can potentially get relatively wealthy from it). Perhaps peertube will be the solution, but I suspect we need something groundbreaking to conquer the monopoly here.

nyxtom 8y ago
Censorship seems to be the main driving force behind users looking at other platforms at the moment. That being said, unfortunately, without the ad model, there's minimal incentives for users to fully migrate to other platforms like Patreon (for instance). If any new platform that wants to come online and compete, it will have to integrate the ad-model to provide any kind of real incentives for the users.
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  Patreon should become a supporter of PeerTube development when Youtube axes Patreon platform use entirely.
  - thecatspaw 8y ago
    why/how would youtube axe Patreon platform use?
    - toomuchtodo 8y ago
      Using Youtube for Patreon videos, generating costs for YT that don't have a revenue/monetization component. https://www.polygon.com/2017/9/28/16380186/youtube-patreon-demonetization-policy https://www.polygon.com/2017/9/28/16380186/youtube-patreon-d... https://mashable.com/2017/09/28/youtube-outside-links-partnership-program/ https://mashable.com/2017/09/28/youtube-outside-links-partne...

rfugger 8y ago

How do you search across all those instances?

austinheap 8y ago
IIRC You can search from any instance that's well-peered: https://instances.joinpeertube.org/instances https://instances.joinpeertube.org/instances

kodablah 8y ago

So close, but ug [0]. A worthy effort (one I might pursue myself) is a self contained binary (or installer if I have to) that runs on Windows, daemonizes/service-izes itself w/ built in web server, dyn DNS's itself or other NAT punch approach, etc. A laudable first step to be sure, but to decentralize we need to target desktops. Many have them at home and are willing to leave them on all day, especially content creators. And it needs to be as easy to setup and non-desktop-invasive as possible. So sqlite instead of postgres? In mem instead of redis? Built-in web server instead of nginx? Windows instead of not-Windows? UI instead of a bunch of scripts? Bandwidth concerns, now we can talk about the value of BT or similar, but lots of content has few enough users to leverage a home connection. Or we can meet in the middle, find a quality hosting reseller, and have a UI that internally deploys containers/content for them for a couple bucks a month. 0 - https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/blob/develop/support/doc/production.md https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube/blob/develop/support/...

toomuchtodo 8y ago
An omnibus Docker container is preferable, and could even be run from always-on home gateways and NAS devices instead of transient desktops. Targeting desktops natively (and the development effort required) would be a bucket of sadness, and IMHO, a waste of time.

tyfon 8y ago

I like this project in it's concept, but I could never get the server to run properly. I also have problems with the fact that the IPs of the watchers are publicly shared due to the nature of the beast (p2p sharing). I'd like something like this but where I could give the users the option of running directly off my server or p2p. Perhaps this is even possible and that I have not seen it yet. It would be awesome if I could run my own "pod" with my let's plays and have it federated throughout the network. Currently I use google but without any form of monetisation as it's a hobby and I don't want to burden people with adds. Knowing google though they probably show adds themselvs and/or penalise me in the search for not having the on.

thepra 8y ago

I was hopeful for something more normal user manageable, an .exe would've be nice :/

narrator 8y ago

So what does this do that bitchute.com or d.tube doesn't do?

sctb 8y ago

Discussions from the last few days: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18204410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18204410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18196255 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18196255

ajvs 8y ago

I prefer the DTube approach personally. It instead uses the Steem blockchain for text content so it doesn't have the issue that ActivityPub or other federation protocols have where it needs to bootstrap to the largest instances, which is in effect partial centralisation. Blockchain use also means that server costs are passively paid for due to block rewards which makes it scalable. Lastly content creators can get paid directly via cryptocurrency so it encourages much more content creation.

14 8y ago

With YouTube I have noticed more and more videos require "age verification" which means forced log in. Just turns me off to be honest. Because first of all, anyone can create an email address and sign up, including my teen kid. So no it is not an age verification but a tracking system. If I am at my moms or a friends and using YouTube I don't want to sign into their potentially compromised pc with my credentials(sadly no yubikey at this time). Plus my password is like 20 long and random generated so I have no chance of remembering it. So I get to these videos and I am blocked from watching it without putting in an effort so I clearly can be tracked. I wait for the day people ditch YouTube for peer tube and the few videos I have in mind to future create, will be straight to peer tube not YouTube. My motivations are to share my knowledge not make any money from it.

TekMol 8y ago
anyone can create an email address and sign up including my teen kid my password is like 20 long and random generated so I have no chance of remembering it. Solution: Ask your kid to set up a throwaway account for you. With an easy to remember password.
- 14 8y ago
  That does not address the tracking I have a problem with so not exactly a solution. Every time I use that throw away account on any pc I become connected forever to that pc in many data points. Youtube is getting plenty of data even if I use a throw away account. I would need to make a new throw away account, from a different ip address each time I wanted to do as you describe to avoid tracking so sometimes I just don't bother with the video.
Confiks 8y ago
This doesn't address your main point, but you might appreciate an easy workaround for this problem: access the video at /embed/$videoid