5 ms·

the real identities of each contributor might be exposed is, quite frankly, horrifying to me Person A adds your name to a list and you'll never know that that'

by gaius 8y ago

the real identities of each contributor might be exposed is, quite frankly, horrifying to me Person A adds your name to a list and you'll never know that that's why Person B tossed your resume in the trash. That's horrifying. And in the UK at least, illegal https://www.personneltoday.com/hr/legal-qa-blacklisting/ https://www.personneltoday.com/hr/legal-qa-blacklisting/

larkeith 8y ago
I don't disagree with this, but it's not mutually exclusive: There are solutions that do not involve wholesale data disclosure. There's also some added complexity given the context: As the failure of the legal system in addressing sexual assault and harassment is responsible for both the necessity of this list and the "guilty until proven innocent" atmosphere that causes it to have impact, it seems questionable to use that selfsame system to punish the workaround developed (the list).
DanBC 8y ago
The spreadsheet wasn't being used to stop men from getting jobs. It was being used to warn women that they may need to protect themselves when working with those men. Please don't conflate the UK laws about blacklisting - which come from a time of vigorous anti-union activism in the construction industry that prevented men from working in any company in their industry for many years (and led to the creation of UK laws about data protection) - with this small private spreadsheet.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- gaius 8y ago
  he spreadsheet wasn't being used to stop men from getting jobs The linked article on Scribd says that that was the purpose of the list. a time of vigorous anti-union activism "They're not union members, this is, umm, some other list" won't fly in front of any judge. ---- I can't reply because I'm "posting too fast" so here is my reply here: I'm familiar with the case. And so there is no doubt: those who have actually committed crimes mentioned on the spreadsheet should be in jail. But anonymous blacklists are not the way to get justice for anyone, they are too open to misuse.
  - DanBC 8y ago
    UK building firms built extensive blacklists of union activists. These blacklists were used for years to prevent those activists working in the construction industry. These blacklists were kept on paper. The first UK data protection law had to be changed to include paper records so that these anti-union blacklists would be covered by the law. Even with the change in the law the black listing probably continued into the 21stC. This was a long running, extensive, campaign https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/feb/27/on-the-blacklist-building-firms-secret-information-on-workers https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/feb/27/on-the-black... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklist_(employment)#UK_Blacklisting_of_trade_union_members https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklist_(employment)#UK_Blac... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consulting_Association https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consulting_Association

by gaius 8y ago

larkeith 8y ago

I don't disagree with this, but it's not mutually exclusive: There are solutions that do not involve wholesale data disclosure. There's also some added complexity given the context: As the failure of the legal system in addressing sexual assault and harassment is responsible for both the necessity of this list and the "guilty until proven innocent" atmosphere that causes it to have impact, it seems questionable to use that selfsame system to punish the workaround developed (the list).

DanBC 8y ago

The spreadsheet wasn't being used to stop men from getting jobs. It was being used to warn women that they may need to protect themselves when working with those men. Please don't conflate the UK laws about blacklisting - which come from a time of vigorous anti-union activism in the construction industry that prevented men from working in any company in their industry for many years (and led to the creation of UK laws about data protection) - with this small private spreadsheet.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
gaius 8y ago
he spreadsheet wasn't being used to stop men from getting jobs The linked article on Scribd says that that was the purpose of the list. a time of vigorous anti-union activism "They're not union members, this is, umm, some other list" won't fly in front of any judge. ---- I can't reply because I'm "posting too fast" so here is my reply here: I'm familiar with the case. And so there is no doubt: those who have actually committed crimes mentioned on the spreadsheet should be in jail. But anonymous blacklists are not the way to get justice for anyone, they are too open to misuse.
- DanBC 8y ago
  UK building firms built extensive blacklists of union activists. These blacklists were used for years to prevent those activists working in the construction industry. These blacklists were kept on paper. The first UK data protection law had to be changed to include paper records so that these anti-union blacklists would be covered by the law. Even with the change in the law the black listing probably continued into the 21stC. This was a long running, extensive, campaign https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/feb/27/on-the-blacklist-building-firms-secret-information-on-workers https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/feb/27/on-the-black... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklist_(employment)#UK_Blacklisting_of_trade_union_members https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklist_(employment)#UK_Blac... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consulting_Association https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consulting_Association