5 ms·

I'm using the Chromebook Pixelbook as my primary development device. I love it ergonomically: great keyboard, love the ability to flip the keyboard behind and u

by xrd 8y ago

I'm using the Chromebook Pixelbook as my primary development device. I love it ergonomically: great keyboard, love the ability to flip the keyboard behind and use as a touchscreen. ChromeOS could be really big, and it makes sense as a brand to switch again from Android for the reason. But, the fact that I lose access to the sound services almost every single time I use the machine is crazy. The response from Google is not encouraging. https://productforums.google.com/forum/?noredirect=true#!topic/chromebook-central/Va6NLP09NJM https://productforums.google.com/forum/?noredirect=true#!top... Basically: Reboot Or, just wipe all your data! If they really expect people to use these as their primary machines or even as just a browsing device, you MUST have sound working 100% of the time. Mine is setup as a developer machine so it could be that I'm bleeding edge. But I'm loathe to switch back, lose all my data, just to see if that fixes things.

kyrra 8y ago
Are you saying that you are in beta or Canary channel? I'm on Canary Channel to get access to crostini, but there are definitely some bugs I've hit over the last few months because of being on Canary.
- williamstein 8y ago
  Crostini is now in stable and works well there.
  - xrd 8y ago
    Switching back to stable (I was on dev) has made audio work reliably for the last 48 hours. And, I can still use crostini/containers now that it is in stable. Crossing fingers!
    - xrd 8y ago
      I think the issue is that if you set your device up for Android Studio and want to connect an external device via USB (https://developer.android.com/topic/arc/development-environment https://developer.android.com/topic/arc/development-environm...) this command will break your sound: sudo crossystem dev_enable_udc=1 It's a PITA, but you can always enable USB, set your device to TCPIP, connect via network, and then turn off dev_enable_udc=0, and reboot...
Theodores 8y ago
It could be worse. I had a low-end Chromebook that I bought to put Linux on it. Part of the reason for this was that I needed a wi-fi repeater and extra screen for my dev machine. A long time later my needs changed and I switched back to running ChromeOS. This install was because I wanted to gift the Chromebook to a friend. So we tested YouTube and the Chromebook was mute. It turned out that installing Linux fried something inside and only a new motherboard would fix that. Luckily I was still on the right side of the warranty expiring, therefore, with no love for the shop I bought it from, I decided to try my luck at getting it repaired. The machine came back box fresh with superb sound. So I was able to gift a 'brand new' machine (which happens to still be on sale) rather than some hand-me down. I am still on Chromebook Pixel 2013 vintage and very happy with it, the Pixelbook was 'meh' to me even though I think I really need one. I was disappointed that they did not go 8th generation Intel with the CPU during this year's product launches for the Pixelbook. So I am now viewing my Pixel (2013) as a future classic, not that computers have this status (Apple 1, Altair excepted). I think Pixelbooks will also have this status but I don't see an 'investment opportunity' in getting one in the hope it will be worth $$$ in decades to come.
- gcb0 8y ago
  lol. something fried because google hardware is notoriously bad, not "because you installed linux". Hardware is not supposed to fry because the software told it to.
  - Theodores 8y ago
    I wasn't clear there as I didn't want to namedrop the brand of the $300 machine, it began with the first letter of the alphabet and was a four letter name. It is not the hardware that is a problem with Google products, there is no 'you must be holding it wrong' nonsense. The problem Google have is in the support. Utterly awful. They have absolutely no idea, as if they are not able to empathise with the customer in any way whatsoever. A budgerigar is as much help. Fortunately my five year old Pixel is as good as new, not a scratch. Despite its age it still impresses people whether they know what it is or not. Few computers do that these days. The wow factor isn't quite up to 'SGI' standards but I always say it is just 'a cheap really old Chromebook'. The room filling sound from the speakers under the keyboard is something I can't believe the newer Pixelbook has to quite the same level of 'high fidelity', I would be gutted if that died due to some upgrade. This won't happen though as updates no longer happen (as of a week ago) due to the age of it. The 2560x1700 'retina plus' native screen mode is also a true delight, particularly with dev tools open. People struggle to read the text and, with them not used to having pinch-to-zoom on their Applebooks, they are amazed that the zoom works just like on a phone.
ericcholis 8y ago
I'm in the market for a new development machine, and wholly afraid of the new Macbooks. What do develop on the Pixelbook? Are you using Linux or Cloud IDEs?
- williamstein 8y ago
  I have a the i7 pixelbook for dev work and I love it. I use both a cloud ide (CoCalc) and Crostini for local Linux and Docker dev work. This is an awesome machine. Very ergonomic, fast, etc. and 2.4 pounds weight. I use the stable channel also and do not use crouton. I don't have trouble with sound.
  - apatheticonion 8y ago
    Wait wait wait wait wait wait. ChromeOS is Linux now? Is it as good as using a full blown Linux distro for development? What languages can you program in? Bash? Is Docker running natively? My head is spinning. I don't want to buy a MacBook, but I'm unhappy with the polish of the Linux world. Is ChromeOS a legitimate alternative?
    - xrd 8y ago
      Yes, you can run any Linux program on it. It has Wayland which converts x11 to the Chromeos windowing metaphor. You can install things using apt-get on your local instance of Linux or use -X with ssh and it just works. It's amazing. But the sound issues, sigh.
      - giancarlostoro 8y ago
        Is it regular x11 apps with ChromeOS' own window manager / skin theme or some weird hack?
        derekp7 8y ago
        x11 apps talk to XWayland, which then talks to Sommelier (a Wayland forwarding agent), which then talks to the Wayland server running on Chrome OS. Other communications between Chrome OS and the Crostini system happens using the gRPC protocol. There is a program called Concierge on the Chrome OS side, that talks to Maitred inside the VM, to get it to do things. And apps inside the container use Garcon to talk to a service called Cicerone on the Chrome OS side (again, both these are over the gRPC protocol). All this is layed out here: https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/docs/+/master/containers_and_vms.md https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/docs/+/master/c...
pasbesoin 8y ago
So, sound sub-system f-ckery. Google is indeed become the new Microsoft. I wouldn't be surprised if these problems intersect continuing DRM clampdown efforts. (I've no actual knowledge of what is going on -- just suspicions based upon product designs and behaviors.)

by xrd 8y ago

kyrra 8y ago

Are you saying that you are in beta or Canary channel? I'm on Canary Channel to get access to crostini, but there are definitely some bugs I've hit over the last few months because of being on Canary.

williamstein 8y ago
Crostini is now in stable and works well there.
- xrd 8y ago
  Switching back to stable (I was on dev) has made audio work reliably for the last 48 hours. And, I can still use crostini/containers now that it is in stable. Crossing fingers!
  - xrd 8y ago
    I think the issue is that if you set your device up for Android Studio and want to connect an external device via USB (https://developer.android.com/topic/arc/development-environment https://developer.android.com/topic/arc/development-environm...) this command will break your sound: sudo crossystem dev_enable_udc=1 It's a PITA, but you can always enable USB, set your device to TCPIP, connect via network, and then turn off dev_enable_udc=0, and reboot...

Theodores 8y ago

It could be worse. I had a low-end Chromebook that I bought to put Linux on it. Part of the reason for this was that I needed a wi-fi repeater and extra screen for my dev machine. A long time later my needs changed and I switched back to running ChromeOS. This install was because I wanted to gift the Chromebook to a friend. So we tested YouTube and the Chromebook was mute. It turned out that installing Linux fried something inside and only a new motherboard would fix that. Luckily I was still on the right side of the warranty expiring, therefore, with no love for the shop I bought it from, I decided to try my luck at getting it repaired. The machine came back box fresh with superb sound. So I was able to gift a 'brand new' machine (which happens to still be on sale) rather than some hand-me down. I am still on Chromebook Pixel 2013 vintage and very happy with it, the Pixelbook was 'meh' to me even though I think I really need one. I was disappointed that they did not go 8th generation Intel with the CPU during this year's product launches for the Pixelbook. So I am now viewing my Pixel (2013) as a future classic, not that computers have this status (Apple 1, Altair excepted). I think Pixelbooks will also have this status but I don't see an 'investment opportunity' in getting one in the hope it will be worth $$$ in decades to come.

gcb0 8y ago
lol. something fried because google hardware is notoriously bad, not "because you installed linux". Hardware is not supposed to fry because the software told it to.
- Theodores 8y ago
  I wasn't clear there as I didn't want to namedrop the brand of the $300 machine, it began with the first letter of the alphabet and was a four letter name. It is not the hardware that is a problem with Google products, there is no 'you must be holding it wrong' nonsense. The problem Google have is in the support. Utterly awful. They have absolutely no idea, as if they are not able to empathise with the customer in any way whatsoever. A budgerigar is as much help. Fortunately my five year old Pixel is as good as new, not a scratch. Despite its age it still impresses people whether they know what it is or not. Few computers do that these days. The wow factor isn't quite up to 'SGI' standards but I always say it is just 'a cheap really old Chromebook'. The room filling sound from the speakers under the keyboard is something I can't believe the newer Pixelbook has to quite the same level of 'high fidelity', I would be gutted if that died due to some upgrade. This won't happen though as updates no longer happen (as of a week ago) due to the age of it. The 2560x1700 'retina plus' native screen mode is also a true delight, particularly with dev tools open. People struggle to read the text and, with them not used to having pinch-to-zoom on their Applebooks, they are amazed that the zoom works just like on a phone.

ericcholis 8y ago

I'm in the market for a new development machine, and wholly afraid of the new Macbooks. What do develop on the Pixelbook? Are you using Linux or Cloud IDEs?

williamstein 8y ago
I have a the i7 pixelbook for dev work and I love it. I use both a cloud ide (CoCalc) and Crostini for local Linux and Docker dev work. This is an awesome machine. Very ergonomic, fast, etc. and 2.4 pounds weight. I use the stable channel also and do not use crouton. I don't have trouble with sound.
- apatheticonion 8y ago
  Wait wait wait wait wait wait. ChromeOS is Linux now? Is it as good as using a full blown Linux distro for development? What languages can you program in? Bash? Is Docker running natively? My head is spinning. I don't want to buy a MacBook, but I'm unhappy with the polish of the Linux world. Is ChromeOS a legitimate alternative?
  - xrd 8y ago
    Yes, you can run any Linux program on it. It has Wayland which converts x11 to the Chromeos windowing metaphor. You can install things using apt-get on your local instance of Linux or use -X with ssh and it just works. It's amazing. But the sound issues, sigh.
    - giancarlostoro 8y ago
      Is it regular x11 apps with ChromeOS' own window manager / skin theme or some weird hack?
      - derekp7 8y ago
        x11 apps talk to XWayland, which then talks to Sommelier (a Wayland forwarding agent), which then talks to the Wayland server running on Chrome OS. Other communications between Chrome OS and the Crostini system happens using the gRPC protocol. There is a program called Concierge on the Chrome OS side, that talks to Maitred inside the VM, to get it to do things. And apps inside the container use Garcon to talk to a service called Cicerone on the Chrome OS side (again, both these are over the gRPC protocol). All this is layed out here: https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/docs/+/master/containers_and_vms.md https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/docs/+/master/c...

pasbesoin 8y ago

So, sound sub-system f-ckery. Google is indeed become the new Microsoft. I wouldn't be surprised if these problems intersect continuing DRM clampdown efforts. (I've no actual knowledge of what is going on -- just suspicions based upon product designs and behaviors.)