5 ms·

Some of those anecdotes do seem pretty far fetched (the cat and battleship) but in my experience Epita/Epitech doesn't produce good software engineers and the d

Some of those anecdotes do seem pretty far fetched (the cat and battleship) but in my experience Epita/Epitech doesn't produce good software engineers and the director Nicolas Sadirac is from there. And, that director really has no idea what he's talking about in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrGgpwl5O4Q&feature=youtu.be&t=2m31s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrGgpwl5O4Q&feature=youtu.be... So, I'm rather skeptical when it comes to Ecole 42. We have great engineering schools in France but the Epita derived schools are really not that great and the only decent graduate I've ever interviewed and hired from one of this school is a self learner who would have been great in any environment.

erowtom 8y ago
> in my experience Epita/Epitech doesn't produce good software engineers Could you explain a bit more? I’m myself from Epitech, and it hurts my feelings :p
- JohnH42 8y ago
  ... Epita, efrei, supinfo ... great great school everybody know this, in France au moins. ... Epitech is a very special little thing. Sadirac, real old hacker from semantec, build just 20 year the futur of computer school: student become teacher, each test is an automatic correction ... So, 42 is bully, in my opinion, but Epitech remain la crème de la crème.
  - bsaul 8y ago
    You do realize that all the epitech staff, including sadirac himself moved to found ecole 42 years ago ?
- seren 8y ago
  Take it with a grain of salt, because I worked mainly in the industry (automotive, telecom, medical devices). Generally, a more generic engineer diploma includes some electrical engineering, mechanics, signal processing, and so on. Sometimes there is a bias against Epita/Epitech candidates that they are too focused on CS or IT but not on more generic knowledge. So they are seen are less well rounded candidates overall. Designing/building system is usually not a purely abstract CS problem but requires to take into account real world constraints. On the other hand, I assume that Epita/Epitech candidates are probably better candidate for an environment like a bank or insurance company.
  - Gumcher 8y ago
    EPITA student here, the thing is the majority of the student are not interested by those area, the first half are more interested going to FB, Google, Nvidia etc... or smaller companies but tech oriented than going to big telecom or medical companies like you said. The other half goes to more corporate / consulting companies because it pays well. Like you said Industry does not promote their sector in our school so no one knows about them or what they offer. It's true that EPITA is definetely more CS oriented, but we are definetely capable of designing / building system (in IT), less in telecom / medical and even less in automotive.The reason is really simple it's because we are not passionate about these industries . Btw EPITA is an engineering school not EPITECH so you can't really compare them they are just part of the same group.
jillav 8y ago
I'm pretty skeptical about that kind of school too. I graduated from an French engineering school and I was taught every-day by researchers and professional engineers. That's what most 18 to 23 year-old kid needs. Structure. I know I needed it. I was a dumb 20 something year old. Plus, that kind of school focuses too much on programming, as in using programming language, and not enough on computer science and engineering. As a result, much of the kids arriving on the job market don't really have an engineering approach to building software. I've seen people using one programming language for most of their carreer, litteraly afraid of switching to another one. Some may feel that the job market is saturated by programmers looking for a job but the truth is, in France anyway, not much have a good engineering mind. I've worked in big companies, i've worked in small companies and I've talked to a lot a recruiters. They do interview a lot of people, from university, engineering school and other formation structures. Truth is i've seen big and small companies recruting students that had majored in anything but CS, juste because they came from an engineering school or university that was known to produce good engineers. Most of those students reavealed themselves to be very talented software engineers. Because they were taught engineering. Not just programming. Of course, students that had majored in CS from engineering had a great head start, but my point is, the engineer skill is really important on the programmer job and most of those bootcamp school overlook it.
- Gumcher 8y ago
  Please do not compare EPITECH or 42 to EPITA they are not the same school at all. There is student teaching at EPITA (the idea come from here) but it is framed and supervised by the school and others teachers (and it's only for programming project, not CS courses that are taught by researcher or teacher). > Some may feel that the job market is saturated by programmers looking for a job but the truth is, in France anyway, not much have a good engineering mind. I've worked in big companies, i've worked in small companies and I've talked to a lot a recruiters. They do interview a lot of people, from university, engineering school and other formation structures. Truth is i've seen big and small companies recruting students that had majored in anything but CS, juste because they came from an engineering school or university that was known to produce good engineers Can you develop this part I'm curious, how do you make the difference between a good engineering mind and a bad one for example ?
realusername 8y ago
> but in my experience Epita/Epitech doesn't produce good software engineers How so? It's one of the best IT schools from France and the concept was even adapted in the US. As an example, I could point to Docker which was founded by epitech students.
- egourlao 8y ago
  > It's one of the best IT schools from France According to whom?
  - realusername 8y ago
    According to me, that's my point of view, you have very few schools which put enough practice to create good developers at the end.
- Gritt 8y ago
  I've been an student assistant at Epitech. The truth is, some are OK but some are ridiculously good, and when I say good they are nowhere near occasional programmer or engineer skillset, they excel in a lot of fields, are able to switch up and learn tech in about 3 days and be very good at it, they learn constantly and have been exposed to innovation research daily. Most of my friends ended up working at Google or getting bought out by Google (Flat, or some of my friends that currently work at GG, most of the normies work in UK) - more importantly they do what they want. Tbh, I don't know how you could impress an Epitech student that has been able to keep his feet on the ground. It happens that some of us get lost in their dark research garage (Hei !) and loose it up for a few, but that usually a period until they figure out what's wrong. Thing is, most of us have been exposed to those crazy good dudes (Hei, i'll write my compiler day 1), (or i'll just make a game on my free time month 2) and steadily we got very very hard to impress. Tough from how the friends have evolved, I assure you we are very concerned by correct resilient architecture. It just happens of who you end up working with.

erowtom 8y ago

> in my experience Epita/Epitech doesn't produce good software engineers Could you explain a bit more? I’m myself from Epitech, and it hurts my feelings :p

JohnH42 8y ago
... Epita, efrei, supinfo ... great great school everybody know this, in France au moins. ... Epitech is a very special little thing. Sadirac, real old hacker from semantec, build just 20 year the futur of computer school: student become teacher, each test is an automatic correction ... So, 42 is bully, in my opinion, but Epitech remain la crème de la crème.
- bsaul 8y ago
  You do realize that all the epitech staff, including sadirac himself moved to found ecole 42 years ago ?
seren 8y ago
Take it with a grain of salt, because I worked mainly in the industry (automotive, telecom, medical devices). Generally, a more generic engineer diploma includes some electrical engineering, mechanics, signal processing, and so on. Sometimes there is a bias against Epita/Epitech candidates that they are too focused on CS or IT but not on more generic knowledge. So they are seen are less well rounded candidates overall. Designing/building system is usually not a purely abstract CS problem but requires to take into account real world constraints. On the other hand, I assume that Epita/Epitech candidates are probably better candidate for an environment like a bank or insurance company.
- Gumcher 8y ago
  EPITA student here, the thing is the majority of the student are not interested by those area, the first half are more interested going to FB, Google, Nvidia etc... or smaller companies but tech oriented than going to big telecom or medical companies like you said. The other half goes to more corporate / consulting companies because it pays well. Like you said Industry does not promote their sector in our school so no one knows about them or what they offer. It's true that EPITA is definetely more CS oriented, but we are definetely capable of designing / building system (in IT), less in telecom / medical and even less in automotive.The reason is really simple it's because we are not passionate about these industries . Btw EPITA is an engineering school not EPITECH so you can't really compare them they are just part of the same group.

jillav 8y ago

I'm pretty skeptical about that kind of school too. I graduated from an French engineering school and I was taught every-day by researchers and professional engineers. That's what most 18 to 23 year-old kid needs. Structure. I know I needed it. I was a dumb 20 something year old. Plus, that kind of school focuses too much on programming, as in using programming language, and not enough on computer science and engineering. As a result, much of the kids arriving on the job market don't really have an engineering approach to building software. I've seen people using one programming language for most of their carreer, litteraly afraid of switching to another one. Some may feel that the job market is saturated by programmers looking for a job but the truth is, in France anyway, not much have a good engineering mind. I've worked in big companies, i've worked in small companies and I've talked to a lot a recruiters. They do interview a lot of people, from university, engineering school and other formation structures. Truth is i've seen big and small companies recruting students that had majored in anything but CS, juste because they came from an engineering school or university that was known to produce good engineers. Most of those students reavealed themselves to be very talented software engineers. Because they were taught engineering. Not just programming. Of course, students that had majored in CS from engineering had a great head start, but my point is, the engineer skill is really important on the programmer job and most of those bootcamp school overlook it.

Gumcher 8y ago
Please do not compare EPITECH or 42 to EPITA they are not the same school at all. There is student teaching at EPITA (the idea come from here) but it is framed and supervised by the school and others teachers (and it's only for programming project, not CS courses that are taught by researcher or teacher). > Some may feel that the job market is saturated by programmers looking for a job but the truth is, in France anyway, not much have a good engineering mind. I've worked in big companies, i've worked in small companies and I've talked to a lot a recruiters. They do interview a lot of people, from university, engineering school and other formation structures. Truth is i've seen big and small companies recruting students that had majored in anything but CS, juste because they came from an engineering school or university that was known to produce good engineers Can you develop this part I'm curious, how do you make the difference between a good engineering mind and a bad one for example ?

realusername 8y ago

> but in my experience Epita/Epitech doesn't produce good software engineers How so? It's one of the best IT schools from France and the concept was even adapted in the US. As an example, I could point to Docker which was founded by epitech students.

egourlao 8y ago
> It's one of the best IT schools from France According to whom?
- realusername 8y ago
  According to me, that's my point of view, you have very few schools which put enough practice to create good developers at the end.
Gritt 8y ago
I've been an student assistant at Epitech. The truth is, some are OK but some are ridiculously good, and when I say good they are nowhere near occasional programmer or engineer skillset, they excel in a lot of fields, are able to switch up and learn tech in about 3 days and be very good at it, they learn constantly and have been exposed to innovation research daily. Most of my friends ended up working at Google or getting bought out by Google (Flat, or some of my friends that currently work at GG, most of the normies work in UK) - more importantly they do what they want. Tbh, I don't know how you could impress an Epitech student that has been able to keep his feet on the ground. It happens that some of us get lost in their dark research garage (Hei !) and loose it up for a few, but that usually a period until they figure out what's wrong. Thing is, most of us have been exposed to those crazy good dudes (Hei, i'll write my compiler day 1), (or i'll just make a game on my free time month 2) and steadily we got very very hard to impress. Tough from how the friends have evolved, I assure you we are very concerned by correct resilient architecture. It just happens of who you end up working with.