4 ms·

When people can't or won't confront the root sources of their ills (corrupt politicians monopolized by rich people), they scapegoat all sorts of other things to

When people can't or won't confront the root sources of their ills (corrupt politicians monopolized by rich people), they scapegoat all sorts of other things to get their angst out unproductively: attacking ideas, movements and people. Populist fascists come along promising all sorts of cures, when they generally make things worse. After failing spectacularly, rebuilding from scratch is usually necessary. Repeat every 1-3 generations. And so it goes.

aogl 8y ago
Interesting view-point, unfortunately often true though
dev_north_east 8y ago
I really dislike this narrative peddled amongst many that Brexit was somehow some kind of Facsist coup. Not wanting to be a part of the EU doesn't imply some evil intent. As an EU citizen living in the UK, I was a very reluctant Remain voter but I prefectly understand why some would want out. I have many friends/aquintences who voted leave and they're not bad people, nor idiots, nor whatever else the Europhiles throw at them.
- blackbrokkoli 8y ago
  Would you mind naming a few of reasons that are valid in your book?
  - dev_north_east 8y ago
    Not wanting to be part of a federalised EU (which is the objective of a lot of the member states/big wigs. let's be honest). It's been a continual bug-bear between the UK and others, probably best for both parties to be separate and allowed to pursue whatever they want. I'm not quite sure how to phrase this properly, but the lack of democracy. What I mean is that democracy/politics need to be both there (which is the case with a lot of the EU) and also visible/tangible to your average citizen (which in my experience, living and working in three EU states is not at all the case). I could go on and on about how remote it seems, how even governments treat EU politics badly etc etc. Regardless the deficit is there and people don't much like it. Also add in dodging the EU constitution vote down, Greece, multiple reruns of votes in Ireland on treaties etc etc. The EU is a horrible bureaucratic mess. I don't see much possibility of meaningful reforms, when they can't even agree not to have to move the whole HQ between Strasbourg and Brussels every month to a huge cost, to no gain. As said, I reluctantly voted Remain but am now hoping that a Norway deal can be pulled from the fire but probably expecting some Canada style fudge.

aogl 8y ago

Interesting view-point, unfortunately often true though

dev_north_east 8y ago

I really dislike this narrative peddled amongst many that Brexit was somehow some kind of Facsist coup. Not wanting to be a part of the EU doesn't imply some evil intent. As an EU citizen living in the UK, I was a very reluctant Remain voter but I prefectly understand why some would want out. I have many friends/aquintences who voted leave and they're not bad people, nor idiots, nor whatever else the Europhiles throw at them.

blackbrokkoli 8y ago
Would you mind naming a few of reasons that are valid in your book?
- dev_north_east 8y ago
  Not wanting to be part of a federalised EU (which is the objective of a lot of the member states/big wigs. let's be honest). It's been a continual bug-bear between the UK and others, probably best for both parties to be separate and allowed to pursue whatever they want. I'm not quite sure how to phrase this properly, but the lack of democracy. What I mean is that democracy/politics need to be both there (which is the case with a lot of the EU) and also visible/tangible to your average citizen (which in my experience, living and working in three EU states is not at all the case). I could go on and on about how remote it seems, how even governments treat EU politics badly etc etc. Regardless the deficit is there and people don't much like it. Also add in dodging the EU constitution vote down, Greece, multiple reruns of votes in Ireland on treaties etc etc. The EU is a horrible bureaucratic mess. I don't see much possibility of meaningful reforms, when they can't even agree not to have to move the whole HQ between Strasbourg and Brussels every month to a huge cost, to no gain. As said, I reluctantly voted Remain but am now hoping that a Norway deal can be pulled from the fire but probably expecting some Canada style fudge.