5 ms·

<disclaimer, MS employee> MS adheres to GDPR regulations and has applied those protections to all users. You can opt out of telemetry, you can view what they'

<disclaimer, MS employee> MS adheres to GDPR regulations and has applied those protections to all users. You can opt out of telemetry, you can view what they've collected on you and delete it. https://www.techrepublic.com/article/microsoft-extending-gdpr-protections-to-all-global-customers-heres-how/ https://www.techrepublic.com/article/microsoft-extending-gdp...

walterbell 8y ago
Does this include data collected from activity on Windows 10 endpoints? Previously, this could only be disabled on Windows 10 Enterprise. Can all on-device data collection and telemetry be disabled on Windows 10 Pro or Home, including "Customer Improvement" data collection, crash logs, keystrokes, screen grabs?
danarmak 8y ago
The article you linked points to an online Microsoft Account Privacy dashboard. I have Windows 10 installed with a local login. I don't have or want an online Microsoft account. It doesn't seem to be possible to disable telemetry in this case, or at least I haven't found out an (officially supported) way to do it.
- mbesto 8y ago
  ^ I'm genuinely curious about this as well. Can anyone at MS clarify?
- bradford 8y ago
  Bottom line, if MS is going to show you telemetry data that's been gathered, they've got to know its you that they've gathered it from, so authentication has to occur. Without going into details, it's hard enough to do this with an online account, and quite impossible for local logon scenarios, and getting it wrong opens up possibilities for malicious actors. So, that's why the privacy dashboard requires a Microsoft account. Best information I can provide on limiting telemetry for the local logon scenario is here: https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-10-feedback-diagnostics-and-privacy https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-10-feedback-diag... I realize that setting it to 'basic' isn't going to satisfy the conspiratorial minded among us, but I will say that I, personally, have no qualms setting my machine to 'basic'. More details, and instructions to disable via regedit following the instructions here: https://www.windowscentral.com/how-opt-out-customer-experience-improvement-program-windows-10 https://www.windowscentral.com/how-opt-out-customer-experien...
  - justinclift 8y ago
    Hang on, are you seriously saying people need to create a MS online account just in order to tell their own computer to NOT send data to MS? That's ridiculous. There should be an obvious friggin question during install "Enable telemetry and data collection?" and if the answer is no... that's it. No telemetry or data collection gets done. Ever. End of story and question doesn't get asked again. Ever. Any other approach is literally just weasel words trying to deceive people. "Just manually change this RegKey setting" is a good example.
    - bradford 8y ago
      No, I'm saying that if you want to view or delete the data that MS has collected, you need an MSA. If you want to downgrade/disable it, you follow the instructions in the links provided.
  - danarmak 8y ago
    > Bottom line, if MS is going to show you telemetry data that's been gathered, they've got to know its you that they've gathered it from, so authentication has to occur. I understand that. I just want to stop sending data from now on. > I realize that setting it to 'basic' isn't going to satisfy the conspiratorial minded among us I want no private or personal data to be sent. Calling me "conspiratorial-minded' is simply wrong. There isn't a conspiracy that Microsoft is collecting data about Windows 10 machines; it's an admitted fact, it was never secret. And I would prefer not to send such data, but Microsoft doesn't want to give me that option. There is no official information on what data is gathered under the Basic setting. The page you linked to has just one sentence, and it's very vague: > information about your device, its settings and capabilities, and whether it is performing properly "Information about your device" could cover a lot indeed. What information does this collect that's covered under GDPR? How has it changed, and will change, over time? Who has access to it? I don't know. That doesn't make me a conspiracy theorist. I don't buy the Microsoft claim from the same page that "This is the minimum level of diagnostic data needed to help keep your device reliable, secure, and operating normally.". It can't be impossible for Windows 10 to be reliable or secure without sending data home. It's evidently not impossible for the Enterprise edition. I accept that this data helps Microsoft do these things, but it should still be my choice as to whether to send it or not, and my right to know what's included in it. And now the law says so too, at least in the EU. The Dutch DPA already determined Microsoft to be in violation of the GDPR a year ago (https://autoriteitpersoonsgegevens.nl/en/news/dutch-dpa-microsoft-breaches-data-protection-law-windows-10 https://autoriteitpersoonsgegevens.nl/en/news/dutch-dpa-micr...). I don't know about more recent developments there. But this isn't just a few private individuals' opinion. > More details, and instructions to disable via regedit Those are not official Microsoft instructions or documented settings. Windows updates have been known to revert them, and (separately) to require changes to the instructions. Messing with the Registry and disabling system services might have other effects beyond the desired. This is not a satisfactory solution, exactly because I do care about "keep[ing] your device reliable, secure, and operating normally".
_emacsomancer_ 8y ago
> You can opt out of telemetry, you can view what they've collected on you and delete it. Until the next update automatically re-enables it (and re-installs MS Paint and Candy Crush).
- scruffyherder 8y ago
  Am I the only one that doesn't get apps auto installed? I wonder if it's because my locale is Hong Kong - English which seems to have basically cut me off from the world when it comes to media, and other recognized options...
ptx 8y ago
Doesn't the GDPR require freely given informed consent? Forgetting to set DOTNET_CLI_TELEMETRY_OPTOUT=1 (or being unaware that you must set it) does not constitute consent.
- gsnedders 8y ago
  It requires informed consent for any personal data being processed. It's entirely plausible to have a useful telemetry system without any personal data. (I have no knowledge of what MS does store.)
  - justinclift 8y ago
    > I have no knowledge of what MS does store. Nor does anyone outside MS.
- zaarn 8y ago
  The GDPR only requires consent if it's personal data that is not necessary for doing business. You don't need consent to store the shipping address of a customer and you don't need to consent to run basic analytics on your database to see what products are popular and how many customers you have. You also don't need consent to process the IP address in the TCP connection from the customer browser so you can show a website (though you do need consent if you log the entire IP for analytics purposes).
  - ptx 8y ago
    Telemetry is not like storing your shipping address, though. It's more like the delivery guy delivering to your shipping address, waiting for you to turn your back and then rummaging through the stuff in your house – unless you happen to shout the magic phrase "Simon says no telemetry!" as soon as you open the door.
    - zaarn 8y ago
      Not really. It's more like the delivery guy noting how long on average you take to get to the door and the average size of packages with the intention of being able to optimize the delivery route and pick the correct delivery vehicle.

walterbell 8y ago

Does this include data collected from activity on Windows 10 endpoints? Previously, this could only be disabled on Windows 10 Enterprise. Can all on-device data collection and telemetry be disabled on Windows 10 Pro or Home, including "Customer Improvement" data collection, crash logs, keystrokes, screen grabs?

danarmak 8y ago

The article you linked points to an online Microsoft Account Privacy dashboard. I have Windows 10 installed with a local login. I don't have or want an online Microsoft account. It doesn't seem to be possible to disable telemetry in this case, or at least I haven't found out an (officially supported) way to do it.

mbesto 8y ago
^ I'm genuinely curious about this as well. Can anyone at MS clarify?
bradford 8y ago
Bottom line, if MS is going to show you telemetry data that's been gathered, they've got to know its you that they've gathered it from, so authentication has to occur. Without going into details, it's hard enough to do this with an online account, and quite impossible for local logon scenarios, and getting it wrong opens up possibilities for malicious actors. So, that's why the privacy dashboard requires a Microsoft account. Best information I can provide on limiting telemetry for the local logon scenario is here: https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-10-feedback-diagnostics-and-privacy https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-10-feedback-diag... I realize that setting it to 'basic' isn't going to satisfy the conspiratorial minded among us, but I will say that I, personally, have no qualms setting my machine to 'basic'. More details, and instructions to disable via regedit following the instructions here: https://www.windowscentral.com/how-opt-out-customer-experience-improvement-program-windows-10 https://www.windowscentral.com/how-opt-out-customer-experien...
- justinclift 8y ago
  Hang on, are you seriously saying people need to create a MS online account just in order to tell their own computer to NOT send data to MS? That's ridiculous. There should be an obvious friggin question during install "Enable telemetry and data collection?" and if the answer is no... that's it. No telemetry or data collection gets done. Ever. End of story and question doesn't get asked again. Ever. Any other approach is literally just weasel words trying to deceive people. "Just manually change this RegKey setting" is a good example.
  - bradford 8y ago
    No, I'm saying that if you want to view or delete the data that MS has collected, you need an MSA. If you want to downgrade/disable it, you follow the instructions in the links provided.
- danarmak 8y ago
  > Bottom line, if MS is going to show you telemetry data that's been gathered, they've got to know its you that they've gathered it from, so authentication has to occur. I understand that. I just want to stop sending data from now on. > I realize that setting it to 'basic' isn't going to satisfy the conspiratorial minded among us I want no private or personal data to be sent. Calling me "conspiratorial-minded' is simply wrong. There isn't a conspiracy that Microsoft is collecting data about Windows 10 machines; it's an admitted fact, it was never secret. And I would prefer not to send such data, but Microsoft doesn't want to give me that option. There is no official information on what data is gathered under the Basic setting. The page you linked to has just one sentence, and it's very vague: > information about your device, its settings and capabilities, and whether it is performing properly "Information about your device" could cover a lot indeed. What information does this collect that's covered under GDPR? How has it changed, and will change, over time? Who has access to it? I don't know. That doesn't make me a conspiracy theorist. I don't buy the Microsoft claim from the same page that "This is the minimum level of diagnostic data needed to help keep your device reliable, secure, and operating normally.". It can't be impossible for Windows 10 to be reliable or secure without sending data home. It's evidently not impossible for the Enterprise edition. I accept that this data helps Microsoft do these things, but it should still be my choice as to whether to send it or not, and my right to know what's included in it. And now the law says so too, at least in the EU. The Dutch DPA already determined Microsoft to be in violation of the GDPR a year ago (https://autoriteitpersoonsgegevens.nl/en/news/dutch-dpa-microsoft-breaches-data-protection-law-windows-10 https://autoriteitpersoonsgegevens.nl/en/news/dutch-dpa-micr...). I don't know about more recent developments there. But this isn't just a few private individuals' opinion. > More details, and instructions to disable via regedit Those are not official Microsoft instructions or documented settings. Windows updates have been known to revert them, and (separately) to require changes to the instructions. Messing with the Registry and disabling system services might have other effects beyond the desired. This is not a satisfactory solution, exactly because I do care about "keep[ing] your device reliable, secure, and operating normally".

_emacsomancer_ 8y ago

> You can opt out of telemetry, you can view what they've collected on you and delete it. Until the next update automatically re-enables it (and re-installs MS Paint and Candy Crush).

scruffyherder 8y ago
Am I the only one that doesn't get apps auto installed? I wonder if it's because my locale is Hong Kong - English which seems to have basically cut me off from the world when it comes to media, and other recognized options...

ptx 8y ago

Doesn't the GDPR require freely given informed consent? Forgetting to set DOTNET_CLI_TELEMETRY_OPTOUT=1 (or being unaware that you must set it) does not constitute consent.

gsnedders 8y ago
It requires informed consent for any personal data being processed. It's entirely plausible to have a useful telemetry system without any personal data. (I have no knowledge of what MS does store.)
- justinclift 8y ago
  > I have no knowledge of what MS does store. Nor does anyone outside MS.
zaarn 8y ago
The GDPR only requires consent if it's personal data that is not necessary for doing business. You don't need consent to store the shipping address of a customer and you don't need to consent to run basic analytics on your database to see what products are popular and how many customers you have. You also don't need consent to process the IP address in the TCP connection from the customer browser so you can show a website (though you do need consent if you log the entire IP for analytics purposes).
- ptx 8y ago
  Telemetry is not like storing your shipping address, though. It's more like the delivery guy delivering to your shipping address, waiting for you to turn your back and then rummaging through the stuff in your house – unless you happen to shout the magic phrase "Simon says no telemetry!" as soon as you open the door.
  - zaarn 8y ago
    Not really. It's more like the delivery guy noting how long on average you take to get to the door and the average size of packages with the intention of being able to optimize the delivery route and pick the correct delivery vehicle.