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1. Bank transfers are reversible. In Europe, you can void a bank transfer up to _several_ days after it has occurred by complaining to your bank. If the bank ag

by vntok 8y ago

1. Bank transfers are reversible. In Europe, you can void a bank transfer up to _several_ days after it has occurred by complaining to your bank. If the bank agrees with you (fraudulent transfer, identity theft, etc), they can ask the receiver's bank to transfer the funds back to you. In France, you have 13 months by law to contest bank transactions after they have taken place. 2. Network fees will be infinitesimal compared to the fees a human wants to extract.

the-dude 8y ago
1. Bank transfers are not generally reversible, only if another party has taken something from your account ( in Dutch "automatische incasso" ). If you did a transfer yourself it is not reversible.
hannasanarion 8y ago
1. this is obviously a good thing. Thieves, fraudsters, and scammers exist. The ability for a trusted third party to roll back history is a feature. 2. How do you know this? Typical POS Credit card processing fees are 2-2.5%. Paypal is 3%. Bitcoin transaction fees can be as high as $50! Unless your typical transaction is 4 digit dollar amounts, credit card processing is cheaper.
- Klathmon 8y ago
  >Bitcoin transaction fees can be as high as $50! 1. This isn't bitcoin 2. They were that high once, and have not been again 3. Point 2 really doesn't hold since they will be that high again if it ever gains mass appeal, however: 4. there are solutions to even that problem that are being tested and rolled out now called Lightning Network. You can think it's all snakeoil or a scam or whatever, but building a little strawman to make it sound like it's pointless isn't helping anyone. There are plenty of things about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies in general that are still unsolved problems, but harping on the fees is silly at this point because it's the one that people are actively trying to solve in just about all cryptocurrencies, and I honestly believe that they have it figured out, and the road forward is just one of adoption and hardening. Stellar uses a system that is pretty much designed to have low fees from the start, and Lightning Network is a pretty damn good way of scaling a blockchain system off the blockchain for the vast majority of transactions making fees a fraction of what they are even now. For example, a single transaction in Stellar right now costs about $0.000002 USD. And that fee is expected to not change significantly, and unlike bitcoin is not variable but is fairly fixed, and will not go up with more activity.

by vntok 8y ago

the-dude 8y ago

1. Bank transfers are not generally reversible, only if another party has taken something from your account ( in Dutch "automatische incasso" ). If you did a transfer yourself it is not reversible.

hannasanarion 8y ago

1. this is obviously a good thing. Thieves, fraudsters, and scammers exist. The ability for a trusted third party to roll back history is a feature. 2. How do you know this? Typical POS Credit card processing fees are 2-2.5%. Paypal is 3%. Bitcoin transaction fees can be as high as $50! Unless your typical transaction is 4 digit dollar amounts, credit card processing is cheaper.

Klathmon 8y ago
>Bitcoin transaction fees can be as high as $50! 1. This isn't bitcoin 2. They were that high once, and have not been again 3. Point 2 really doesn't hold since they will be that high again if it ever gains mass appeal, however: 4. there are solutions to even that problem that are being tested and rolled out now called Lightning Network. You can think it's all snakeoil or a scam or whatever, but building a little strawman to make it sound like it's pointless isn't helping anyone. There are plenty of things about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies in general that are still unsolved problems, but harping on the fees is silly at this point because it's the one that people are actively trying to solve in just about all cryptocurrencies, and I honestly believe that they have it figured out, and the road forward is just one of adoption and hardening. Stellar uses a system that is pretty much designed to have low fees from the start, and Lightning Network is a pretty damn good way of scaling a blockchain system off the blockchain for the vast majority of transactions making fees a fraction of what they are even now. For example, a single transaction in Stellar right now costs about $0.000002 USD. And that fee is expected to not change significantly, and unlike bitcoin is not variable but is fairly fixed, and will not go up with more activity.