9 ms·

Update to Ask HN: What to do if I’m about to lose my job to mental health issues

269 points by throwawaydev00 8y ago

smithmayowa 8y ago
Great to see that things seem to have turned around for the better for you. No one deserves to ever feel deppressed, I say this confidently, having been swallowed by depression once and succesfully coming out to tell its woefull tales, it's great to see another person escape from its cold, lonely, and sad clutch.
cfitz 8y ago
> My post 4 months ago is why I'm here today. It's the singular action that pushed me to talk to my work, to talk to a therapist, and eventually to talk to my parents. The truth is it's easy to hole yourself up when you reach a dark enough place, but sometimes staying silent is its own torture. Huge props to you for stepping out and sharing what you were going through. If only this was more commonplace for others in your situation. At the end of the day, we all deserve to be happy, and I hope you reach that point very soon through careful management of all things “life”.
Regardsyjc 8y ago
Congratulations OP and thank you for sharing your inspiring update. When I read your post it sounded like you were being a little too hard on yourself. Something that helps me is instead of thinking about how far there still is to go, thinking about how far you've come so far. Or as Adam Grant says: "After reaching a goal, raising the bar often increases motivation but decreases happiness. To enjoy your success, imagine how your past self would see your current achievements. If you knew 5 years ago what you’d accomplish now, how proud would you have been?" You're doing great. Thanks for sharing again and keep it up!!
bonniemuffin 8y ago
If you want some help getting your financial life back on track, the folks in /r/personalfinance are pretty understanding and supportive. If you lay out your budget and situation, they can help you come up with a plan, and having a plan to get back on your feet financially will probably have all kinds of good benefits for your general mental wellbeing.
jurassic 8y ago
> My savings had already been wiped out by a car accident I am always amazed when I see statements like this coming from people in highly-paid professions. It seems like the OP has already figured out that financial insecurity contributes a LOT to stress and can force us into very sub-optimal decisions. Props to them for connecting those dots. I hope everybody reading this post takes a moment to review their financial readiness for different levels of calamity. If you don't have an emergency fund, make some small adjustments to pile up the cash ASAP.
- maxerickson 8y ago
  Disability insurance too.
  - mmt 8y ago
    Unfortunately, this advices is potentially too shallow to be useful, as (private/individual) DI is tricky. For it to be useful long-term, you'll need to find a policy with both guaranteed renewal and guaranteed coverage increase as your income rises, before any chronic conditions appear (or are diagnosed) or things like car accidents occur and become pre-existing conditions. There are other details that make shopping for a policy tedious/tricky, such as differences in "own occupation" coverage, post-disability inflation protection not being standard, and the fact that you probably want to choose a company that'll be solvent 40 years later (since there's no pre-existing condition exclusion-exception portability like for health insurance, AFAIK). Meanwhile, while you're employed, those payments, which can be $50-$100/mo post-tax, may be a total waste, since your employer is likely paying for group disability coverage, and no (reasonably-priced) policy will double-pay. Usually, anything you get from Social Security (or any state-mandated) disability will also reduce the benefit. That is, the total from all sources will be capped by the most generous policy at somewhere around 60% of pre-disability income. The market seems to be geared toward self-employed professionals, such as dentists, rather than the typical tech worker. All that said, here's my advice: If your employer offers you a "tax option" or "imputed income" on the disability insurance premium, choose it (and if they don't offer it, ask for it). Paying the extra few dollars per paycheck in tax will mean that 60%-of-pre-disability-income won't be subject to income tax and would actually be close to a total income replacement.
CaptainZapp 8y ago
Kudos for the courage of writing this up. Just one thing that occurred to me. Reconsider the necessity to find a good therapist. It can be so immensely helpful. Best of luck on your ventures and your health!
- maxxxxx 8y ago
  "Reconsider the necessity to find a good therapist." When I had depression I found this a very difficult and frustrating task that was depressing by itself. I don't want to say that most therapist are bad but they are humans and it's very hard to find one that matches well with the patient.
swedish_mafia 8y ago
Why don’t you see a doctor, and get prescribed some meds?
- geofft 8y ago
  That was answered in the post: > I've put off finding a new therapist and psychiatrist because of the same catch-22 that was affecting me earlier, being depressed removing my motivation, but writing this post and reliving the last few months has reminded me that nothing good will come of continuing that.
Smushman 8y ago
Keep seeing your therapist along this journey - it will help you 'take a time out' to think about your situation and validate your progress. 1. Break your fall. Depression, and any 'invisible' illness, are highly distracting. Like trying to getting an A while getting electric shocks during every class and study. It can be done (not by me, but by some I guess) but it is really really hard. You'll miss obvious problems, solutions, and obvious signs that act as cues at other times. You need to turn down the voltage a bit. First, quick fixes. These are antidepressants. They are a good temporary measure but not more than 3 maybe 6 months. Depression kills all forward progress, and antidepressants can release some of this pressure temporarily - freeing you to begin moving to long term solutions. That is really all antidepressants are good for. 2. Find out-of-the-box effective solutions to your depression - immediately. First, I have been helped by western herbals (St. John's Wort is proven long term effective but takes time to get going), ayurvedic Indian herbal treatments (start with Ashwagandha), Chinese herbs, gut related bacteria and probiotics (strong ones like kombucha every day - not gentle 'nudges' like yogurt). Focus on the medicine vs the doctor/treatment. Dr visits can take a month or more and are expensive - your health can't wait. Focus on the herbs themselves vs visiting the ayurvedic practitioner, acupuncturist, or Chinese Herbalist. Via the internet, I stole bits and pieces of the most effective treatments in non-western medicine and cobbled together my own solutions. Second, Yoga exercise routines, and add the Yoga mindfulness stuff later if you can (but at least the exercise routines). You must do this. Yoga is proven and will help you - but you can't stop there (and will find it hard to start if you have not broken your fall yet). Exercise and treatment must always be combined. Third, mindfulness. Know you will make it through. You may not know how yet, but you will make it. Fake it 'til you make it is a proven strategy - but not enough alone. 3. If you do not have the ability to share your focus with your job (balancing your health treatment and your job) get a quick fix (antidepressant) going right away to 'turn down the voltage'. And let whatever happens to you job - happen. Panic and anxiety about a job you may be losing is waste of your very precious and limited resources (you may even find your wrong about your fears!). Remember your solution order - 1. Break you fall (quick fix) and turn down the voltage a little. 2. Come up with long term solutions/strategies to turn it down a lot, and keep it down. 3. And finally - focus on your job last. Your good health will do much more for your job and life than your very best but highly distracted efforts can ever do. Best of luck - I will be watching for your updates. You have a chronic problem - you must treat it like one.
p4bl0 8y ago
When I read stuff like this I'm so glad to live in a country (France) that doesn't let people without any money when they're fired or have serious medical issues. Nation-wide solidarity costs little to each person but gives a lot to those who need it. So sad that our public unemployment and health systems are getting destroyed piece by piece by successive governments (the current one is particularly agressive).
- fromthestart 8y ago
  >Nation-wide solidarity costs little to each person Federal income tax in France is greater than 45%[1]. There's nothing cheap about that. I much prefer the freedom of saving my own money, especially when working in something as lucrative as tech. 1.https://tradingeconomics.com/france/personal-income-tax-rate https://tradingeconomics.com/france/personal-income-tax-rate
  - simonsaidit 8y ago
    Yes if all you think about is yourself then that works well.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
    - antidesitter 8y ago
      > Yes if all you think about is yourself How does saving your own money preclude you from thinking about others?
      - fjsolwmv 8y ago
        It was implied in he commment, since commenter didn't add in a factor to cover donations to others.
        antidesitter 8y ago
cbanek 8y ago
I'm so happy to hear that things are looking up for you. I remember when you posted the first time, and I was really hoping things would work out. As someone prone to depression throughout their entire life, I have to agree that a bad job situation can make a depressive-leaning person's life really bad. I've been going through similar things for the last few months. I think this is also pushing me to get my own therapist lined up again, as it's been a while. Like you, I know that there are some things I need help with, and there's no shame in that. But god, finding mental health professionals is so hard! Just don't slide back, it's so easy to do, and it can really hurt for a long time.
- tomatocracy 8y ago
  I'd go further than that. A bad job situation can make anyone's life really bad. If you spend more than 50% of your waking hours somewhere, how could it not? Although my situation was not anything like as bad, I went through a similar situation two years ago. The two things I wish in retrospect I'd done differently are (1) get therapy sooner and (2) get out sooner. The feeling I had the day I quit that employer is one of the best feelings I've ever had, even though it was a place I thought I loved. I'm still doing the same job at a different employer, but the difference is night and day. At least in my past situation, a huge part of the issue was in recognising that I was in that situation in the first place. These types of workplace issues have a nasty habit of creeping up slowly, day by day, week by week, so that you don't notice them. I kept thinking "it's just this current situation around [x] thing", when really it was the whole environment. Add even a small amount of home/personal life stress on top of that (dealing with very young or teenage kids, moving house, illness, money worries, relationship problems, ...) and it can be the straw that broke the camel's back. I really wish good therapy (with a therapist of your choice) was something which health insurance/the NHS paid for (at least in the UK, it doesn't). I hate to think of how many people in these types of situations are put off by the cost.
woofyman 8y ago
When I’ve been depressed, here’s what worked for me. 1) long walks in nature 2) eat well 3) sleep (If necessary get a prescription for trazodone, they’re cheap $7.50 for 90 pills) 4) antidepressant meds
- m-i-l 8y ago
  > "When I’ve been depressed, here’s what worked for me. 1) long walks in nature" Interestingly "Doctors in Shetland are to start prescribing birdwatching, rambling and beach walks in the Atlantic winds to help treat chronic and debilitating illnesses for the first time. From Friday [5 Oct 2018], doctors working in the 10 GP surgeries on the islands will be authorised by the archipelago’s health board, NHS Shetland, to issue 'nature prescriptions' to patients to help treat mental illness, diabetes, heart disease, stress and other conditions." [0] [0] https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/oct/05/scottish-gps-nhs-begin-prescribing-rambling-birdwatching https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/oct/05/scottish-gps...
  - tomatocracy 8y ago
    Yes. I would add that it's not just "in nature" that's important (and it is) but also "walks" - physical activity, even light physical activity like walking, can be a huge help to some people in combating stress and depression (but of course, everyone's different so these aren't completely universal).
_zskd 8y ago
I'm glad you are getting the help you need. Michael Jordan has a coach. Programmers and other brain workers have therapists. It's so obvious to me that having a neutral person who helps you track and set goals, track your moods, and help you process work relationships and events has a huge benefit. But people ignore this! They are in this macho culture where you need to be self reliant and going to a therapist is weird and weak. So instead of getting help, they place the burden on their friends and family and co-workers to tolerate and correct their shitty behavior. Your friends or wife is not your therapist. They are not trained, are not impartial, and wouldn't you rather be having a good time then forcing them to listen to your constant whining? I'm diagnosed bipolar and have gotten things under control with the help of a therapist WITHOUT medication. It's a powerful experience and a cheat-code to productivity.
gjm11 8y ago
Just to save readers a couple of clicks, here's the original Ask HN to which this is a follow-up: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17087155 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17087155
chad_strategic 8y ago
> Fortunately, I had been searching for work before that day, my therapist had helped me realize, part of my depression was from feeling the job was inadequate. It involved minimal effort and had failed to fulfill what I was looking for when I left my last position. This is part of my issue as well. But most importantly, thank you for your story. (It seems that someone is cutting some onions at my desk, either that or a lot of dust in my office.) Never underestimate the power of sharing your story. Thank you.
itwrangler 8y ago
Well done.. Transitions out of mental illness are personal and difficult - telling your story may help. If you are still suffering you are right you need to get more talking help as that, IMO, will be the key to long term recovery. And I mean long term. 'Shoring up' for the long term is the best you can do for yourself on a practical level now - work, earn, save, clear debts, that's the practical steps. Medically get all the help you can - be it meds, therapy, new ideas.. Maybe get some new ideas happening for you too? On a philosophical front I mean, I find episodes of depression come with a big slab of "what's the point" and have thus sometimes found (but this is very individual I guess) that exposure to new stuff - meditation, buddhism, books/reflections on philosophy etc helped in the sense of 'seeing a bigger picture'. Getting 'out of oneself' type activities are helpful during episodes IMO as it reduces (a little) that introversion which seems to happen and be quite damaging when in the depth of depression. I had two years out of work after depression and substance abuse treatment (I managed to keep my job during this period whilst barely functioning for a couple of years, more due to bad HR management than anything I did, i.e. inertia/incompetence on their part). It took 12 months of the out of work time just to get recovery up to a level where I felt I'd be capable of working again, and then another 9 months to actually get a gig.. It's a long road, without light sometimes it feels.. but it will pass if you ensure you keep the minimal practicals together and ensure you get outside help to deal with what's going on in your head. You are absolutely not alone. Take care and good luck! S
14 8y ago
Good luck and I hope you continue to thrive and feel well.
akeck 8y ago
Congratulations on clawing your way back. After reading about the "Zunger Shock Sieve" [0], I've started building up my emergency funds. In the US, health issues are unfortunately a common path to financial distress. [0] https://shift.newco.co/2017/12/04/your-financial-shock-wealth/ https://shift.newco.co/2017/12/04/your-financial-shock-wealt...
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
carterza 8y ago
I'm not presently going through exactly what you went through - but I can relate on many levels. I've been on and off anti-depressants since I was sixteen, and I'm 33 now. My self-confidence has been basically destroyed, and I've kind of been just a shell of a human being ever since middle school. I've never figured myself out, and I've never felt like I've had time to, or the space and energy. I've been in and out of therapy, I've been to rehab, and I've seen lots of professionals - psychiatrists and therapists. My current psychiatrist is helping me a lot - but it also seems like it's two steps forward, and three backwards. During the spring, I gained a lot of confidence, and felt like I was back on track, and it only took one thing going haywire in my plans, for everything to once again fall off the rails. Like you - I finally broke down to my parents (who have been amazingly supportive over the years) - and this isn't the first time I've broken down in front of them - but hopefully it's the last. I've decided that the career path I've sought for myself, which is the line of work they both worked in, isn't for me. My main goal right now, which I'm going to need their help with (because at this point accomplishing basic tasks like opening my email / checking my physical mail - are terrifying to me), is to sell the house I purchased several years ago. This thing has been a boat anchor, and has helped keep me stuck by requiring a certain level of monthly income. After that, I hope to quit my job and set out across the country to do some soul searching. Hopefully via the house sale and savings I've accrued, I can keep myself afloat for a while, while I pursue new opportunities. My goal is to enter a new industry, that is arguably more rigorous than the one I'm leaving, but I feel like my current position has contributed quite a bit to my deterioration in mental health, and that it's not what I love - or even want - to do. Ultimately, I keep myself going by remembering the alternative is not an option. I try to think that things will get better, but it's difficult at times. The one thing I can always rely on fortunately (and this isn't true for many), is family and my close friends. Networking is very important, and so is remembering that everyone, including you and me, deserves to be happy.
- wjossey 8y ago
  Best of luck to you as you make these changes. Your journey is yours alone to make, so don’t take this advice but rather an anecdote. When I was able to better understand what I valued in life (which is also constantly changing) I was able to find a lot more peace in my day to day life. I do what I value. I avoid what I do not. Much of what I value comes with challenges, pain, and difficulty, but because I value it the friction proves beneficial in the long wrong. I eschew things I don’t value (social media), but constantly reevaluate and challenge myself. Good luck. I hope you find what you’re seeking.
_RPM 8y ago
I'm glad the therapist worked for you. For me, my stance on therapy is that it's bullshit tried and true. I was in therapy for 1 year before realizing that I was going in there and making up problems I was having. I had 4 therapist in that time. The first 2 were actually horrible, and it was basically a sweatshop getting you in and out. Basically, they sit there and listen, and let you talk about things. Giving you advice? No way. Being an authoritative person? No. I was not able to fully accept that the empathy therapist show is FAKE, it's not real. You're literally paying them to sit there and listen to you. I wasn't able to get over the fact that they don't care about you or your life, at the end of the day it's a business. For instance, let's say one day you lose your insurance? All of sudden your therapist isn't going to help you anymore, etc. It's all bullshit.
- JamesBarney 8y ago
  I think it being a business doesn't preclude their empathy. I'm sure most therapists care about their patients. I care about the software projects I'm on, and really want them to succeed, and my clients to gets lots of value out of those projects. But I'm not going to work for them for free. If you want to talk to someone for free there are friends, family and acquaintances. But that comes with its own set of obligations. If every time I saw a friend I complained about the same issues over and over again I wouldn't have many friends.
snow_mac 8y ago
Zoloft man. It has helped me so much
benrawk 8y ago
Antidepressants really do help. Especially for getting out of the lowest lows. Then, when you are out of the lowest lows, the other things (like talk therapy) have a chance to be effective.
- hndamien 8y ago
  I absolutely hate anti-depressents but there is some truth to this statement.
monotone666 8y ago
I had a psychotic break from reality while employed a few years ago. This was mostly due to a long term viral infection... It sounds like you can barely work. Is it possible for you to get a easier job or one that’s more physical? Taking care of the bare minimums like food and shelter are priority number one. Everything else comes second. Therapy and meds can go a long way but you’ll still face living with a disability. The outlook is bleak unless you can provide for yourself and at least enjoy eating. I recommend cats and cspan.
anon7429 8y ago
CBD helped me significantly.
colehasson 8y ago
Thank you for sharing your story

Great to see that things seem to have turned around for the better for you. No one deserves to ever feel deppressed, I say this confidently, having been swallowed by depression once and succesfully coming out to tell its woefull tales, it's great to see another person escape from its cold, lonely, and sad clutch.

cfitz 8y ago

> My post 4 months ago is why I'm here today. It's the singular action that pushed me to talk to my work, to talk to a therapist, and eventually to talk to my parents. The truth is it's easy to hole yourself up when you reach a dark enough place, but sometimes staying silent is its own torture. Huge props to you for stepping out and sharing what you were going through. If only this was more commonplace for others in your situation. At the end of the day, we all deserve to be happy, and I hope you reach that point very soon through careful management of all things “life”.

Regardsyjc 8y ago

Congratulations OP and thank you for sharing your inspiring update. When I read your post it sounded like you were being a little too hard on yourself. Something that helps me is instead of thinking about how far there still is to go, thinking about how far you've come so far. Or as Adam Grant says: "After reaching a goal, raising the bar often increases motivation but decreases happiness. To enjoy your success, imagine how your past self would see your current achievements. If you knew 5 years ago what you’d accomplish now, how proud would you have been?" You're doing great. Thanks for sharing again and keep it up!!

bonniemuffin 8y ago

If you want some help getting your financial life back on track, the folks in /r/personalfinance are pretty understanding and supportive. If you lay out your budget and situation, they can help you come up with a plan, and having a plan to get back on your feet financially will probably have all kinds of good benefits for your general mental wellbeing.

jurassic 8y ago

> My savings had already been wiped out by a car accident I am always amazed when I see statements like this coming from people in highly-paid professions. It seems like the OP has already figured out that financial insecurity contributes a LOT to stress and can force us into very sub-optimal decisions. Props to them for connecting those dots. I hope everybody reading this post takes a moment to review their financial readiness for different levels of calamity. If you don't have an emergency fund, make some small adjustments to pile up the cash ASAP.

maxerickson 8y ago
Disability insurance too.
- mmt 8y ago
  Unfortunately, this advices is potentially too shallow to be useful, as (private/individual) DI is tricky. For it to be useful long-term, you'll need to find a policy with both guaranteed renewal and guaranteed coverage increase as your income rises, before any chronic conditions appear (or are diagnosed) or things like car accidents occur and become pre-existing conditions. There are other details that make shopping for a policy tedious/tricky, such as differences in "own occupation" coverage, post-disability inflation protection not being standard, and the fact that you probably want to choose a company that'll be solvent 40 years later (since there's no pre-existing condition exclusion-exception portability like for health insurance, AFAIK). Meanwhile, while you're employed, those payments, which can be $50-$100/mo post-tax, may be a total waste, since your employer is likely paying for group disability coverage, and no (reasonably-priced) policy will double-pay. Usually, anything you get from Social Security (or any state-mandated) disability will also reduce the benefit. That is, the total from all sources will be capped by the most generous policy at somewhere around 60% of pre-disability income. The market seems to be geared toward self-employed professionals, such as dentists, rather than the typical tech worker. All that said, here's my advice: If your employer offers you a "tax option" or "imputed income" on the disability insurance premium, choose it (and if they don't offer it, ask for it). Paying the extra few dollars per paycheck in tax will mean that 60%-of-pre-disability-income won't be subject to income tax and would actually be close to a total income replacement.

CaptainZapp 8y ago

Kudos for the courage of writing this up. Just one thing that occurred to me. Reconsider the necessity to find a good therapist. It can be so immensely helpful. Best of luck on your ventures and your health!

maxxxxx 8y ago
"Reconsider the necessity to find a good therapist." When I had depression I found this a very difficult and frustrating task that was depressing by itself. I don't want to say that most therapist are bad but they are humans and it's very hard to find one that matches well with the patient.

swedish_mafia 8y ago

Why don’t you see a doctor, and get prescribed some meds?

geofft 8y ago
That was answered in the post: > I've put off finding a new therapist and psychiatrist because of the same catch-22 that was affecting me earlier, being depressed removing my motivation, but writing this post and reliving the last few months has reminded me that nothing good will come of continuing that.

Smushman 8y ago

Keep seeing your therapist along this journey - it will help you 'take a time out' to think about your situation and validate your progress. 1. Break your fall. Depression, and any 'invisible' illness, are highly distracting. Like trying to getting an A while getting electric shocks during every class and study. It can be done (not by me, but by some I guess) but it is really really hard. You'll miss obvious problems, solutions, and obvious signs that act as cues at other times. You need to turn down the voltage a bit. First, quick fixes. These are antidepressants. They are a good temporary measure but not more than 3 maybe 6 months. Depression kills all forward progress, and antidepressants can release some of this pressure temporarily - freeing you to begin moving to long term solutions. That is really all antidepressants are good for. 2. Find out-of-the-box effective solutions to your depression - immediately. First, I have been helped by western herbals (St. John's Wort is proven long term effective but takes time to get going), ayurvedic Indian herbal treatments (start with Ashwagandha), Chinese herbs, gut related bacteria and probiotics (strong ones like kombucha every day - not gentle 'nudges' like yogurt). Focus on the medicine vs the doctor/treatment. Dr visits can take a month or more and are expensive - your health can't wait. Focus on the herbs themselves vs visiting the ayurvedic practitioner, acupuncturist, or Chinese Herbalist. Via the internet, I stole bits and pieces of the most effective treatments in non-western medicine and cobbled together my own solutions. Second, Yoga exercise routines, and add the Yoga mindfulness stuff later if you can (but at least the exercise routines). You must do this. Yoga is proven and will help you - but you can't stop there (and will find it hard to start if you have not broken your fall yet). Exercise and treatment must always be combined. Third, mindfulness. Know you will make it through. You may not know how yet, but you will make it. Fake it 'til you make it is a proven strategy - but not enough alone. 3. If you do not have the ability to share your focus with your job (balancing your health treatment and your job) get a quick fix (antidepressant) going right away to 'turn down the voltage'. And let whatever happens to you job - happen. Panic and anxiety about a job you may be losing is waste of your very precious and limited resources (you may even find your wrong about your fears!). Remember your solution order - 1. Break you fall (quick fix) and turn down the voltage a little. 2. Come up with long term solutions/strategies to turn it down a lot, and keep it down. 3. And finally - focus on your job last. Your good health will do much more for your job and life than your very best but highly distracted efforts can ever do. Best of luck - I will be watching for your updates. You have a chronic problem - you must treat it like one.

p4bl0 8y ago

When I read stuff like this I'm so glad to live in a country (France) that doesn't let people without any money when they're fired or have serious medical issues. Nation-wide solidarity costs little to each person but gives a lot to those who need it. So sad that our public unemployment and health systems are getting destroyed piece by piece by successive governments (the current one is particularly agressive).

fromthestart 8y ago
>Nation-wide solidarity costs little to each person Federal income tax in France is greater than 45%[1]. There's nothing cheap about that. I much prefer the freedom of saving my own money, especially when working in something as lucrative as tech. 1.https://tradingeconomics.com/france/personal-income-tax-rate https://tradingeconomics.com/france/personal-income-tax-rate
- simonsaidit 8y ago
  Yes if all you think about is yourself then that works well.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - antidesitter 8y ago
    > Yes if all you think about is yourself How does saving your own money preclude you from thinking about others?
    - fjsolwmv 8y ago
      It was implied in he commment, since commenter didn't add in a factor to cover donations to others.
      - antidesitter 8y ago

cbanek 8y ago

I'm so happy to hear that things are looking up for you. I remember when you posted the first time, and I was really hoping things would work out. As someone prone to depression throughout their entire life, I have to agree that a bad job situation can make a depressive-leaning person's life really bad. I've been going through similar things for the last few months. I think this is also pushing me to get my own therapist lined up again, as it's been a while. Like you, I know that there are some things I need help with, and there's no shame in that. But god, finding mental health professionals is so hard! Just don't slide back, it's so easy to do, and it can really hurt for a long time.

tomatocracy 8y ago
I'd go further than that. A bad job situation can make anyone's life really bad. If you spend more than 50% of your waking hours somewhere, how could it not? Although my situation was not anything like as bad, I went through a similar situation two years ago. The two things I wish in retrospect I'd done differently are (1) get therapy sooner and (2) get out sooner. The feeling I had the day I quit that employer is one of the best feelings I've ever had, even though it was a place I thought I loved. I'm still doing the same job at a different employer, but the difference is night and day. At least in my past situation, a huge part of the issue was in recognising that I was in that situation in the first place. These types of workplace issues have a nasty habit of creeping up slowly, day by day, week by week, so that you don't notice them. I kept thinking "it's just this current situation around [x] thing", when really it was the whole environment. Add even a small amount of home/personal life stress on top of that (dealing with very young or teenage kids, moving house, illness, money worries, relationship problems, ...) and it can be the straw that broke the camel's back. I really wish good therapy (with a therapist of your choice) was something which health insurance/the NHS paid for (at least in the UK, it doesn't). I hate to think of how many people in these types of situations are put off by the cost.

woofyman 8y ago

When I’ve been depressed, here’s what worked for me. 1) long walks in nature 2) eat well 3) sleep (If necessary get a prescription for trazodone, they’re cheap $7.50 for 90 pills) 4) antidepressant meds

m-i-l 8y ago
> "When I’ve been depressed, here’s what worked for me. 1) long walks in nature" Interestingly "Doctors in Shetland are to start prescribing birdwatching, rambling and beach walks in the Atlantic winds to help treat chronic and debilitating illnesses for the first time. From Friday [5 Oct 2018], doctors working in the 10 GP surgeries on the islands will be authorised by the archipelago’s health board, NHS Shetland, to issue 'nature prescriptions' to patients to help treat mental illness, diabetes, heart disease, stress and other conditions." [0] [0] https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/oct/05/scottish-gps-nhs-begin-prescribing-rambling-birdwatching https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/oct/05/scottish-gps...
- tomatocracy 8y ago
  Yes. I would add that it's not just "in nature" that's important (and it is) but also "walks" - physical activity, even light physical activity like walking, can be a huge help to some people in combating stress and depression (but of course, everyone's different so these aren't completely universal).

_zskd 8y ago

I'm glad you are getting the help you need. Michael Jordan has a coach. Programmers and other brain workers have therapists. It's so obvious to me that having a neutral person who helps you track and set goals, track your moods, and help you process work relationships and events has a huge benefit. But people ignore this! They are in this macho culture where you need to be self reliant and going to a therapist is weird and weak. So instead of getting help, they place the burden on their friends and family and co-workers to tolerate and correct their shitty behavior. Your friends or wife is not your therapist. They are not trained, are not impartial, and wouldn't you rather be having a good time then forcing them to listen to your constant whining? I'm diagnosed bipolar and have gotten things under control with the help of a therapist WITHOUT medication. It's a powerful experience and a cheat-code to productivity.

gjm11 8y ago

Just to save readers a couple of clicks, here's the original Ask HN to which this is a follow-up: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17087155 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17087155

chad_strategic 8y ago

> Fortunately, I had been searching for work before that day, my therapist had helped me realize, part of my depression was from feeling the job was inadequate. It involved minimal effort and had failed to fulfill what I was looking for when I left my last position. This is part of my issue as well. But most importantly, thank you for your story. (It seems that someone is cutting some onions at my desk, either that or a lot of dust in my office.) Never underestimate the power of sharing your story. Thank you.

itwrangler 8y ago

Well done.. Transitions out of mental illness are personal and difficult - telling your story may help. If you are still suffering you are right you need to get more talking help as that, IMO, will be the key to long term recovery. And I mean long term. 'Shoring up' for the long term is the best you can do for yourself on a practical level now - work, earn, save, clear debts, that's the practical steps. Medically get all the help you can - be it meds, therapy, new ideas.. Maybe get some new ideas happening for you too? On a philosophical front I mean, I find episodes of depression come with a big slab of "what's the point" and have thus sometimes found (but this is very individual I guess) that exposure to new stuff - meditation, buddhism, books/reflections on philosophy etc helped in the sense of 'seeing a bigger picture'. Getting 'out of oneself' type activities are helpful during episodes IMO as it reduces (a little) that introversion which seems to happen and be quite damaging when in the depth of depression. I had two years out of work after depression and substance abuse treatment (I managed to keep my job during this period whilst barely functioning for a couple of years, more due to bad HR management than anything I did, i.e. inertia/incompetence on their part). It took 12 months of the out of work time just to get recovery up to a level where I felt I'd be capable of working again, and then another 9 months to actually get a gig.. It's a long road, without light sometimes it feels.. but it will pass if you ensure you keep the minimal practicals together and ensure you get outside help to deal with what's going on in your head. You are absolutely not alone. Take care and good luck! S

14 8y ago

Good luck and I hope you continue to thrive and feel well.

akeck 8y ago

Congratulations on clawing your way back. After reading about the "Zunger Shock Sieve" [0], I've started building up my emergency funds. In the US, health issues are unfortunately a common path to financial distress. [0] https://shift.newco.co/2017/12/04/your-financial-shock-wealth/ https://shift.newco.co/2017/12/04/your-financial-shock-wealt...

deleted 8y ago

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carterza 8y ago

I'm not presently going through exactly what you went through - but I can relate on many levels. I've been on and off anti-depressants since I was sixteen, and I'm 33 now. My self-confidence has been basically destroyed, and I've kind of been just a shell of a human being ever since middle school. I've never figured myself out, and I've never felt like I've had time to, or the space and energy. I've been in and out of therapy, I've been to rehab, and I've seen lots of professionals - psychiatrists and therapists. My current psychiatrist is helping me a lot - but it also seems like it's two steps forward, and three backwards. During the spring, I gained a lot of confidence, and felt like I was back on track, and it only took one thing going haywire in my plans, for everything to once again fall off the rails. Like you - I finally broke down to my parents (who have been amazingly supportive over the years) - and this isn't the first time I've broken down in front of them - but hopefully it's the last. I've decided that the career path I've sought for myself, which is the line of work they both worked in, isn't for me. My main goal right now, which I'm going to need their help with (because at this point accomplishing basic tasks like opening my email / checking my physical mail - are terrifying to me), is to sell the house I purchased several years ago. This thing has been a boat anchor, and has helped keep me stuck by requiring a certain level of monthly income. After that, I hope to quit my job and set out across the country to do some soul searching. Hopefully via the house sale and savings I've accrued, I can keep myself afloat for a while, while I pursue new opportunities. My goal is to enter a new industry, that is arguably more rigorous than the one I'm leaving, but I feel like my current position has contributed quite a bit to my deterioration in mental health, and that it's not what I love - or even want - to do. Ultimately, I keep myself going by remembering the alternative is not an option. I try to think that things will get better, but it's difficult at times. The one thing I can always rely on fortunately (and this isn't true for many), is family and my close friends. Networking is very important, and so is remembering that everyone, including you and me, deserves to be happy.

wjossey 8y ago
Best of luck to you as you make these changes. Your journey is yours alone to make, so don’t take this advice but rather an anecdote. When I was able to better understand what I valued in life (which is also constantly changing) I was able to find a lot more peace in my day to day life. I do what I value. I avoid what I do not. Much of what I value comes with challenges, pain, and difficulty, but because I value it the friction proves beneficial in the long wrong. I eschew things I don’t value (social media), but constantly reevaluate and challenge myself. Good luck. I hope you find what you’re seeking.

_RPM 8y ago

I'm glad the therapist worked for you. For me, my stance on therapy is that it's bullshit tried and true. I was in therapy for 1 year before realizing that I was going in there and making up problems I was having. I had 4 therapist in that time. The first 2 were actually horrible, and it was basically a sweatshop getting you in and out. Basically, they sit there and listen, and let you talk about things. Giving you advice? No way. Being an authoritative person? No. I was not able to fully accept that the empathy therapist show is FAKE, it's not real. You're literally paying them to sit there and listen to you. I wasn't able to get over the fact that they don't care about you or your life, at the end of the day it's a business. For instance, let's say one day you lose your insurance? All of sudden your therapist isn't going to help you anymore, etc. It's all bullshit.

JamesBarney 8y ago
I think it being a business doesn't preclude their empathy. I'm sure most therapists care about their patients. I care about the software projects I'm on, and really want them to succeed, and my clients to gets lots of value out of those projects. But I'm not going to work for them for free. If you want to talk to someone for free there are friends, family and acquaintances. But that comes with its own set of obligations. If every time I saw a friend I complained about the same issues over and over again I wouldn't have many friends.

snow_mac 8y ago

Zoloft man. It has helped me so much

benrawk 8y ago

Antidepressants really do help. Especially for getting out of the lowest lows. Then, when you are out of the lowest lows, the other things (like talk therapy) have a chance to be effective.

hndamien 8y ago
I absolutely hate anti-depressents but there is some truth to this statement.

monotone666 8y ago

I had a psychotic break from reality while employed a few years ago. This was mostly due to a long term viral infection... It sounds like you can barely work. Is it possible for you to get a easier job or one that’s more physical? Taking care of the bare minimums like food and shelter are priority number one. Everything else comes second. Therapy and meds can go a long way but you’ll still face living with a disability. The outlook is bleak unless you can provide for yourself and at least enjoy eating. I recommend cats and cspan.

anon7429 8y ago

CBD helped me significantly.

colehasson 8y ago

Thank you for sharing your story