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This "Dutch reach" thing is an example of a phenomenon I've seen several times before. People who promote a practice seem to think their argument will be more

This "Dutch reach" thing is an example of a phenomenon I've seen several times before. People who promote a practice seem to think their argument will be more persuasive if the practice came from an admired foreign country, yet the people who live in that country have never heard of it and/or do not commonly do it. In this case it's the Dutch, but I've seen all kinds of similar nonsense about Japan.

wool_gather 8y ago
The article explains clearly that it is a thing in the Netherlands; it's a standard part of driver education there. > “It’s just what Dutch people do,” said Fred Wegman, professor emeritus of Traffic Safety at Delft University of Technology and the former managing director of the National Institute for Road Safety Research SWOV in the Netherlands. “All Dutch are taught it. It’s part of regular driver education.”
- holstvoogd 8y ago
  weird, I wasn't, never heard of anyone who has. i should ask some colleagues if they were taught it.
  - wool_gather 8y ago
    Interesting; perhaps this Traffic Safety professor does not have a realistic view of driving instruction. I.e., it's part of the official curriculum but not actually taught?
    - rocqua 8y ago
      There is a theory test to a drivers license as well. It's never mentioned there. If it is a part of testing, it is probably a generic line 'Be mindful when getting out of the car'. Perhaps some instructors teach the 'dutch reach' as a trick for that. There are many such heuristics that are taught. For example, family of me was advised to wear contacts instead of glasses for the test because the legs of the glasses could block the instructors view of the eyes. Apparently, they want to see you check all angles.
      - askmike 8y ago
        >If it is a part of testing, it is probably a generic line 'Be mindful when getting out of the car'. I failed my practical driving exam because I didn't open the door properly. I tried to explain that I looked before getting out. Failed it nonetheless.
- rocqua 8y ago
  It was not a part of my dutch driver education 2 years ago. I was taught as a kid to look in the mirror before opening the door. That was more about keeping safe from cars than taking care of cyclists.
- twblalock 8y ago
  Here come Dutch HN commenters who never heard of it. And there are more elsewhere in the thread. The article is not accurate. It’s a perfect example of what I was talking about.
  - fjsolwmv 8y ago
    Most people don't remember the rules of the road, they just adapt to common and intuition practice over years of driving. In the USA, many or most states have laws stating that drivers must yield to pedestrians at unmarked crosswalks (every intersection is a legal crosswalk), but most drivers don't know that "unmarked crosswalks" exist.
    - twblalock 8y ago
      I think the Dutch people posting here know whether or not they reach across their body and open their driver-side door with their right hand. So I believe them when they say the article is wrong.
- IkmoIkmo 8y ago
  Never heard of it. /D
holstvoogd 8y ago
yup, can confirm, isn't really a thing here in the Netherlands. the thing is though, since we have so many cyclist, you do tend to look behind before opening the car door. if you have some sense at least ;) but it is not even something you are taught specifically. Only cyclist specific thing I got in my driving lessons was how they can hide behind the pillar when approaching a roundabout, so you should lean forward to check.
- askmike 8y ago
  > but it is not even something you are taught specifically. I have different experiences. I failed a driving exam once when I failed to do open the door properly (eg. with left instead of right hand).
DonHopkins 8y ago
The Dutch just call it "The Reach". It's like in space, how they don't call it a "Space Bathroom", it's just a "Bathroom".
- twblalock 8y ago
  You'll see in this thread a lot of Dutch commenters who say they don't do the reach as it is described, nevermind what it is called in English or Dutch.
- skrebbel 8y ago
  Ehh, no we don't. We don't do it and we don't call it anything.
  - DonHopkins 8y ago
    I must have it confused with a "Dutch Rudder", which the Dutch just call a "Rudder". ;)
    - skrebbel 8y ago
      Haha! Wow I had to urbandictionary that one, but yes, that's actually the usual way we copulate.
raarts 8y ago
I am Dutch. My wife is a driving instructor. She says that drivers should be taught the Dutch Reach: hold the door with your left hand, unlock and open it with your right hand, look in your mirrors and through the door opening, if it's safe open the door fully and leave the car. Walk toward the back of the car so you are facing the traffic. (When entering the car you go around the front of the car for that same reason.). But it's not true that you fail the exam if you don't follow this procedure. She also says many instructors do not give a f*ck and skip teaching these procedures. The Dutch people claiming it's not a thing are either older or had a sloppy driving instructor. EDIT: in the past people were taught the: "look in the mirror and over your shoulder" method. Many older instructors still teach this.
- mcv 8y ago
  I've been taught this. Or at least parts of it; I'm not sure about the walking towards the back. But whatever I was taught, I know very well to always pay attention to the other traffic. I find it bizarre that some people don't as soon as their car stops.

wool_gather 8y ago

The article explains clearly that it is a thing in the Netherlands; it's a standard part of driver education there. > “It’s just what Dutch people do,” said Fred Wegman, professor emeritus of Traffic Safety at Delft University of Technology and the former managing director of the National Institute for Road Safety Research SWOV in the Netherlands. “All Dutch are taught it. It’s part of regular driver education.”

holstvoogd 8y ago
weird, I wasn't, never heard of anyone who has. i should ask some colleagues if they were taught it.
- wool_gather 8y ago
  Interesting; perhaps this Traffic Safety professor does not have a realistic view of driving instruction. I.e., it's part of the official curriculum but not actually taught?
  - rocqua 8y ago
    There is a theory test to a drivers license as well. It's never mentioned there. If it is a part of testing, it is probably a generic line 'Be mindful when getting out of the car'. Perhaps some instructors teach the 'dutch reach' as a trick for that. There are many such heuristics that are taught. For example, family of me was advised to wear contacts instead of glasses for the test because the legs of the glasses could block the instructors view of the eyes. Apparently, they want to see you check all angles.
    - askmike 8y ago
      >If it is a part of testing, it is probably a generic line 'Be mindful when getting out of the car'. I failed my practical driving exam because I didn't open the door properly. I tried to explain that I looked before getting out. Failed it nonetheless.
rocqua 8y ago
It was not a part of my dutch driver education 2 years ago. I was taught as a kid to look in the mirror before opening the door. That was more about keeping safe from cars than taking care of cyclists.
twblalock 8y ago
Here come Dutch HN commenters who never heard of it. And there are more elsewhere in the thread. The article is not accurate. It’s a perfect example of what I was talking about.
- fjsolwmv 8y ago
  Most people don't remember the rules of the road, they just adapt to common and intuition practice over years of driving. In the USA, many or most states have laws stating that drivers must yield to pedestrians at unmarked crosswalks (every intersection is a legal crosswalk), but most drivers don't know that "unmarked crosswalks" exist.
  - twblalock 8y ago
    I think the Dutch people posting here know whether or not they reach across their body and open their driver-side door with their right hand. So I believe them when they say the article is wrong.
IkmoIkmo 8y ago
Never heard of it. /D

holstvoogd 8y ago

yup, can confirm, isn't really a thing here in the Netherlands. the thing is though, since we have so many cyclist, you do tend to look behind before opening the car door. if you have some sense at least ;) but it is not even something you are taught specifically. Only cyclist specific thing I got in my driving lessons was how they can hide behind the pillar when approaching a roundabout, so you should lean forward to check.

askmike 8y ago
> but it is not even something you are taught specifically. I have different experiences. I failed a driving exam once when I failed to do open the door properly (eg. with left instead of right hand).

DonHopkins 8y ago

The Dutch just call it "The Reach". It's like in space, how they don't call it a "Space Bathroom", it's just a "Bathroom".

twblalock 8y ago
You'll see in this thread a lot of Dutch commenters who say they don't do the reach as it is described, nevermind what it is called in English or Dutch.
skrebbel 8y ago
Ehh, no we don't. We don't do it and we don't call it anything.
- DonHopkins 8y ago
  I must have it confused with a "Dutch Rudder", which the Dutch just call a "Rudder". ;)
  - skrebbel 8y ago
    Haha! Wow I had to urbandictionary that one, but yes, that's actually the usual way we copulate.

raarts 8y ago

I am Dutch. My wife is a driving instructor. She says that drivers should be taught the Dutch Reach: hold the door with your left hand, unlock and open it with your right hand, look in your mirrors and through the door opening, if it's safe open the door fully and leave the car. Walk toward the back of the car so you are facing the traffic. (When entering the car you go around the front of the car for that same reason.). But it's not true that you fail the exam if you don't follow this procedure. She also says many instructors do not give a f*ck and skip teaching these procedures. The Dutch people claiming it's not a thing are either older or had a sloppy driving instructor. EDIT: in the past people were taught the: "look in the mirror and over your shoulder" method. Many older instructors still teach this.

mcv 8y ago
I've been taught this. Or at least parts of it; I'm not sure about the walking towards the back. But whatever I was taught, I know very well to always pay attention to the other traffic. I find it bizarre that some people don't as soon as their car stops.