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Linux comes with Apache, Python, C/C++, Perl, AWK, sed, vi, emacs, and more. Windows comes with Minesweeper. When I was starting out there was no Microsoft or

Linux comes with Apache, Python, C/C++, Perl, AWK, sed, vi, emacs, and more. Windows comes with Minesweeper. When I was starting out there was no Microsoft or Linux. I got a machine that had a programming lanuage built in to it, and I could write programs. Pretty much the first large program I wrote was a compiler to convert a subset of BASIC into Z80. It was written in its own subset, and could compile itself. I hacked into the cassette save routines, smashed the stack, bootstrapped into a machine code monitor (not even assembler) that I wrote, and I was writing games for people to play. It's always seemed to me that Microsoft almost actively prevented me from using my own machine. I couldn't get into it without buying more. And more. I wrote my own OS that sat on top of DOS, then write a compiler for that, and suddenly I could write games again. And finance applications. And mathematical explorations. I found some of the first Perrin pseudo-primes that way, bypassing Microsoft's systems because they prevented me from doind what I wanted with the resources I had access to. I don't hate Microsoft, but every time I use a Windows box it fails in interesting ways, costing me time, effort, patience and occasionally yet more money. I'll use Linux. ADDED IN EDIT AFTER RE-READING: And I'll continue to contribute to various open-source projects.

gaius 16y ago
So what? If you want developer tools, they're a free download on microsoft.com http://www.microsoft.com/express/ http://www.microsoft.com/express/ Microsoft can't win here, if they shipped all that with the base OS there'd be haters hatin' on them for "bloat".
- RiderOfGiraffes 16y ago
  I wish I'd never answered. It's a religious war - no one will win. Lots of people will end up bloodied. I should've known better. Still, I did reply, so let me tell you of my personal experience, and then I'll leave. My experience is that working in a Microsoft environment as I have in the past, everything seemed bloody awkward and more annoying. Working in a Linux environment I've had far fewer hassles, and the system just doesn't get in the way. My experience, my circumstances. I don't hate Microsoft, I've just found I'm more productive in other systems. And I'll say nothing more on the subject. I can't care enough to do so. In fact, I couldn't really care less.
  - gaius 16y ago
    Nah, I use both platforms, I have no axe to grind. Just correcting a factual error. If you are on Windows and want to (learn to) code, the tools are readily available (and barely more hassle to install than apt-get).
recoiledsnake 16y ago
>Linux comes with Apache, Python, C/C++, Perl, AWK, sed, vi, emacs, and more. >Windows comes with Minesweeper. Erm... you can download for free compilers from Microsoft or the Visual Studio Express editions. Or you could get all of those above things for Windows. You get IIS with Windows. Why should MS bundle those into Windows and waste disk space for 99.5% of people who will never use it? BTW Ubuntu does not come with GCC. http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=120421 http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=120421 >It's always seemed to me that Microsoft almost actively prevented me from using my own machine. I couldn't get into it without buying more. Uhh what? We are not talking about iOS here where you need to pay $99/year for the privilege of developing. Can you elaborate?
- RiderOfGiraffes 16y ago
  > Erm... you can download for free compilers from > Microsoft or the Visual Studio Express editions. > Or you could get all of those above things for > Windows. You get IIS with Windows. Maybe you can now, but when I was getting into programming you couldn't. Things have changed, but consider a more recent example. I use a Windows laptop when travelling because I can no longer be bothered with the hassle of dealing with customer support who have no clue that anything other than Windows exists. If I have touble connecting to someone's hacked up, third-rate wireless internet, I'd better be using Windows or I'm screwed. But I use Open Office. Oh, look, Microsoft now has a docx format, and half the world assumes everyone else is running the very latest version of Windows, and Word, and now I'm being sent documents I can't read. At the time this started I checked, and I looked, and nowhere could I find any way to read or convert these files without paying for a new version of Word. Time and time again I have these problems, and when I do, they seem to be associated with Microsoft. I don't hate them, I just avoid them. Most of my computing pain in the past 30 years has come from them. And in truth I don't care, and don't think about them. I have better things to do.
  - recoiledsnake 16y ago
    >At the time this started I checked, and I looked, and nowhere could I find any way to read or convert these files without paying for a new version of Word. You should have looked and checked harder. Word Viewer was always free. http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/en/details.aspx?FamilyID=3657ce88-7cfa-457a-9aec-f4f827f20cac&displaylang=en http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/en/details.aspx?FamilyID=... >View, print and copy Word documents, even if you don't have Word installed.

gaius 16y ago

So what? If you want developer tools, they're a free download on microsoft.com http://www.microsoft.com/express/ http://www.microsoft.com/express/ Microsoft can't win here, if they shipped all that with the base OS there'd be haters hatin' on them for "bloat".

RiderOfGiraffes 16y ago
I wish I'd never answered. It's a religious war - no one will win. Lots of people will end up bloodied. I should've known better. Still, I did reply, so let me tell you of my personal experience, and then I'll leave. My experience is that working in a Microsoft environment as I have in the past, everything seemed bloody awkward and more annoying. Working in a Linux environment I've had far fewer hassles, and the system just doesn't get in the way. My experience, my circumstances. I don't hate Microsoft, I've just found I'm more productive in other systems. And I'll say nothing more on the subject. I can't care enough to do so. In fact, I couldn't really care less.
- gaius 16y ago
  Nah, I use both platforms, I have no axe to grind. Just correcting a factual error. If you are on Windows and want to (learn to) code, the tools are readily available (and barely more hassle to install than apt-get).

recoiledsnake 16y ago

>Linux comes with Apache, Python, C/C++, Perl, AWK, sed, vi, emacs, and more. >Windows comes with Minesweeper. Erm... you can download for free compilers from Microsoft or the Visual Studio Express editions. Or you could get all of those above things for Windows. You get IIS with Windows. Why should MS bundle those into Windows and waste disk space for 99.5% of people who will never use it? BTW Ubuntu does not come with GCC. http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=120421 http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=120421 >It's always seemed to me that Microsoft almost actively prevented me from using my own machine. I couldn't get into it without buying more. Uhh what? We are not talking about iOS here where you need to pay $99/year for the privilege of developing. Can you elaborate?

RiderOfGiraffes 16y ago
> Erm... you can download for free compilers from > Microsoft or the Visual Studio Express editions. > Or you could get all of those above things for > Windows. You get IIS with Windows. Maybe you can now, but when I was getting into programming you couldn't. Things have changed, but consider a more recent example. I use a Windows laptop when travelling because I can no longer be bothered with the hassle of dealing with customer support who have no clue that anything other than Windows exists. If I have touble connecting to someone's hacked up, third-rate wireless internet, I'd better be using Windows or I'm screwed. But I use Open Office. Oh, look, Microsoft now has a docx format, and half the world assumes everyone else is running the very latest version of Windows, and Word, and now I'm being sent documents I can't read. At the time this started I checked, and I looked, and nowhere could I find any way to read or convert these files without paying for a new version of Word. Time and time again I have these problems, and when I do, they seem to be associated with Microsoft. I don't hate them, I just avoid them. Most of my computing pain in the past 30 years has come from them. And in truth I don't care, and don't think about them. I have better things to do.
- recoiledsnake 16y ago
  >At the time this started I checked, and I looked, and nowhere could I find any way to read or convert these files without paying for a new version of Word. You should have looked and checked harder. Word Viewer was always free. http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/en/details.aspx?FamilyID=3657ce88-7cfa-457a-9aec-f4f827f20cac&displaylang=en http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/en/details.aspx?FamilyID=... >View, print and copy Word documents, even if you don't have Word installed.