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Indeed, this will presumably affect users of Eclipse, Netbeans and similar. Not sure how many non-developer apps make use of those APIs, though, especially as t

Indeed, this will presumably affect users of Eclipse, Netbeans and similar. Not sure how many non-developer apps make use of those APIs, though, especially as they don't quite produce native look & feel. (still much better than X11, which is indeed terrible on OSX)

nileshk 16y ago
I think Eclipse is in a better position to handle this because it uses SWT instead of Swing. SWT is not produced by Apple, and uses native widgets (for OS X, there is both a Cocoa and Carbon version). So in theory, Eclipse could run on something like Soylatte without having to use X11. It's the Swing apps (such as Netbeans, etc) that are potentially in trouble. Apple has been maintaining their own code for Swing. If they are going to stop maintaining this, I hope they contribute their changes back to OpenJDK so that someone attempting to maintain a Mac version does not have to reimplement this. I wonder if Apple is really going to stop maintaining their port of Java, or if this move is to be able to say "you can't use Java for App Store for Mac apps because we could possibly stop including it." Or maybe they are planning to hand over development to Oracle.
- umjames 16y ago
  Or maybe they're not interested in being on the other end of an Oracle lawsuit. I don't know.
  - wmf 16y ago
    Apple paid for Java; they're not going to get sued.
    - wtracy 16y ago
      I wonder if Oracle just increased the price?
      - wmf 16y ago
        That thought occurred to me; maybe Apple decided not to renew their license.
Samuel_Michon 16y ago
@nileshk: "I wonder if Apple is really going to stop maintaining their port of Java, or if this move is to be able to say "you can't use Java for App Store for Mac apps because we could possibly stop including it."" From Apple's Mac App Store review guidelines: "Apps that use deprecated or optionally installed technologies (e.g., Java, [PowerPC code requiring] Rosetta) will be rejected." http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/10/20/apple_issues_review_guidelines_for_mac_app_store.html http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/10/20/apple_issues_r... Java in XCode was already deprecated, but it sounds like there won't even be a (standard) install of the Java runtime in Mac OS X Lion.
rbritton 16y ago
The product ordering software for every photographer-centric company I've ever dealt with is written in Java. Given that a large portion of photographers use Macs, this could have a big impact there.
nevster 16y ago
I'll have a lot of users who'll be sad if they can't run my app http://www.auctionsieve.com/ http://www.auctionsieve.com/ I don't use any Mac specific APIs except for checking/setting some properties to do things like put the menus in the right place. The rest is straight Swing. So no great loss as long as Oracle provides a good implementation.

nileshk 16y ago

I think Eclipse is in a better position to handle this because it uses SWT instead of Swing. SWT is not produced by Apple, and uses native widgets (for OS X, there is both a Cocoa and Carbon version). So in theory, Eclipse could run on something like Soylatte without having to use X11. It's the Swing apps (such as Netbeans, etc) that are potentially in trouble. Apple has been maintaining their own code for Swing. If they are going to stop maintaining this, I hope they contribute their changes back to OpenJDK so that someone attempting to maintain a Mac version does not have to reimplement this. I wonder if Apple is really going to stop maintaining their port of Java, or if this move is to be able to say "you can't use Java for App Store for Mac apps because we could possibly stop including it." Or maybe they are planning to hand over development to Oracle.

umjames 16y ago
Or maybe they're not interested in being on the other end of an Oracle lawsuit. I don't know.
- wmf 16y ago
  Apple paid for Java; they're not going to get sued.
  - wtracy 16y ago
    I wonder if Oracle just increased the price?
    - wmf 16y ago
      That thought occurred to me; maybe Apple decided not to renew their license.

Samuel_Michon 16y ago

@nileshk: "I wonder if Apple is really going to stop maintaining their port of Java, or if this move is to be able to say "you can't use Java for App Store for Mac apps because we could possibly stop including it."" From Apple's Mac App Store review guidelines: "Apps that use deprecated or optionally installed technologies (e.g., Java, [PowerPC code requiring] Rosetta) will be rejected." http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/10/20/apple_issues_review_guidelines_for_mac_app_store.html http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/10/20/apple_issues_r... Java in XCode was already deprecated, but it sounds like there won't even be a (standard) install of the Java runtime in Mac OS X Lion.

rbritton 16y ago

The product ordering software for every photographer-centric company I've ever dealt with is written in Java. Given that a large portion of photographers use Macs, this could have a big impact there.

nevster 16y ago

I'll have a lot of users who'll be sad if they can't run my app http://www.auctionsieve.com/ http://www.auctionsieve.com/ I don't use any Mac specific APIs except for checking/setting some properties to do things like put the menus in the right place. The rest is straight Swing. So no great loss as long as Oracle provides a good implementation.