5 ms·

'Distracted boyfriend meme' is sexist, rules Swedish advertising watchdog

20 points by rustcharm 8y ago

DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
Why am I not surprised that they somehow managed to turn it around to be sexist towards women? I'm honestly surprised that it was even considered to also be sexist towards men. Either way, this seems like an overreaction. I don't know anybody who I believe would be offended by that meme, so I don't see a need to make a big deal out of that. EDIT: I wrote the above after reading just the first paragraph. After reading just two more, I have to correct myself: I am disgusted at what the article paints as the most common reaction, that the meme is mostly sexist towards women. Bt! There's so many ways in which that's just a grotesque misrepresentation, most importantly that the man is clearly the "bad guy" in the situation. EDIT 2: The article quotes the company in question: "Everyone who follows the internet and meme culture knows how the meme is used and interpreted. [Whether someone is a] man, woman or neutral gender is often irrelevant in this context. We are an internet company and are conversant in this, as are those who would look for a job with us, so we turned to that target group [...] If we should be punished for anything, it's for using an old and tired meme." It's interesting to see their perspective on things. The sentiment that in the internet it gender is "irrelevant" is ironically the less sexist view of the two, and the fact that they used the chance to state that they are interested in employing people who share that idea was probably a really good idea. It seems like they are showing a giant middle finger to both those who attack them for made up reasons and actual sexists. Brilliant. (Though arguable, the accusations that the meme is sexist towards women is also rather sexist, in that it completely ignores/accepts the image that men are dumb and only act based on their sex drive, have no respect at all for their partners and are the gender that is more likely to cheat)
- wutbrodo 8y ago
  This is pretty unsurprising, as we're talking about Sweden here. This is the country that stopped gender quotas got universities once they reached 60% women and started getting sued by women who were rejected by programs in favor of ostensibly equally-qualified men. Though it doesn't mesh well with my personal ethics/philosophy, I'm not a die-hard opponent of identity-based tweaks to merit-based systems and think that support in some situations is at least defensible. But Ive seen little to indicate that there's any pretense of intellectual honesty or moral consistency in Sweden's approach to gender politics, beyond simply a special interest group throwing their weight around.
  - DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
    It makes me wonder though, what is this even about? Nobody can possibly profit from this directly, so is it to show how much political power a certain movement has? Regardless of what it is, this is just mean and unjust. People are being essentially punished for crimes they didn't commit.
_Codemonkeyism 8y ago
Hurray, this is such a sexist meme against men, glad they recognize that.
- DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
  Except they didn't (I guess you forgot to add /S ^^)
  - _Codemonkeyism 8y ago
    Oh sorry, didn't read the article and jumped to conclusions :-(
dtujmer 8y ago
People get upset about relatively unimportant things. I'm pretty sure sexism exists and is bad, but this is just... not it. It's a dumb meme, that's all.
- onion2k 8y ago
  It's not really up to you or me to dictate what other people think though, or what they feel is important to them, so the fact you think it's a dumb meme isn't relevant. That's why we have courts.
  - sdinsn 8y ago
    Courts shouldn't be wasting their time on this. If courts spent time on every single thing people complained about, nothing important would get done.
    - onion2k 8y ago
      That's why we have levels of courts and people whose job it is to decide whether or not a case has merit based on arguments brought by interested parties. We can't say something is a waste of time just by looking at it. We can't see the nuance at the heart of every matter. Again, it's not for you or me to dictate what is actually important. Not important to you is not the same as being objectively unimportant.
      - iopq 8y ago
        Courts shouldn't have so many resources that they should be looking at things like that for one thing, a use of a meme doesn't infringe on anyone's rights
      - sdinsn 8y ago
        > We can't say something is a waste of time just by looking at it. We sure can.
- richmarr 8y ago
Yaa101 8y ago
I really wonder when Sweden is going to prosecute nature...
- Double_a_92 8y ago
  The point is to punish men for doing "manly" things. The feminist agenda is not some crazy conspiracy theory anymore.
minork 8y ago
If you have not been in war for 200+ years, you can focus on real serious things...
- DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
  Well, in a way, the fact that this is a problem in 2018 really shows how good our lives are, that we can focus on that kind of ridiculous non-issue.
- rasz 8y ago
  https://www.thelocal.se/20180508/why-sweden-doesnt-keep-stats-on-ethnic-background-and-crime https://www.thelocal.se/20180508/why-sweden-doesnt-keep-stat... https://www.politico.eu/article/sweden-bombings-grenade-attacks-violent-reality-undoing-peaceful-self-image-law-and-order/ https://www.politico.eu/article/sweden-bombings-grenade-atta... There are no problems when you outlaw reporting them.
hanoz 8y ago
I'm pleased to see that what the people are really concerned about, as defined by this page's popular articles section, is: Swedish road covered in herring after elk accident
- rasz 8y ago
  this is a more realistic daily occurrence, I will let you guess who the "gang" was and why it wasnt reported: https://www.thelocal.se/20181004/police-officer-assaulted-by-group-in-central-southern-sweden https://www.thelocal.se/20181004/police-officer-assaulted-by...
TomMarius 8y ago
Yeah it is, but against men, what the hell?
talltimtom 8y ago
It’s not sexist neither against men or against women. There are tons of cases of both men and woman having extra marital affairs or cheating. Depicting a situation which is realistic to occur does not have to imply that all woman or all men are anything. If I take a picture of my SO making a sandwich I’m not somehow trying to make implicit assertions about the maternal patriarchy. If that was the case every single picture of overweight men or overweight woman would be “sexist” because they somehow imply everyone of that gender is overweight.
- bkor 8y ago
  > extra marital affairs or cheating That's not a situation shown in the picture. I find it annoying that it pretends that man are solely focussed on appearance, as if there's no mind or thought in men.
  - manicdee 8y ago
    I find it annoying that people pretend the image is about men and not just one man who is about to get a clip over the ear.
- DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
  The thing is, those who disagree are not willing to compromise on that. They state as an absolute that any depiction of a gender stereotype reinforces that stereotype in those who are exposed to it and thus keep sexism going. If they stopped believing that premise, their entire argumentation would fall apart, so I doubt it's possible to convince them of that they're wrong.
  - teilo 8y ago
    It is not possible to convince them that they are wrong. The denial of gender differences, or even the existence of gender itself, is practically a religious tenet. It does not yield to science or even common sense.
baud147258 8y ago
This story is what, one week old now? Why are talking about it again?
qubax 8y ago
Watchdog groups should only exist for a short period of time and for a specific purpose. If it is open ended, it will inevitable arrive at an extreme. In a sexist society, if I was paying you to find sexism against women, you'd be able to find obvious examples of it. But as society changes and societal sexism against women disappears, what are you left to do? You still have to find examples of sexism to justify your job. Imagine in your quarterly report, you tell your boss there is no more sexism. Well then, your boss might think, well why is your position need any more? But you like your job and the easy paycheck. So you are now incentivized to see sexism where none exists.
bryanlarsen 8y ago
The meme may or may not be sexist on it's own, there are good arguments on both side. When used as part of a job ad? Very different consideration.

20 points by rustcharm 8y ago

Why am I not surprised that they somehow managed to turn it around to be sexist towards women? I'm honestly surprised that it was even considered to also be sexist towards men. Either way, this seems like an overreaction. I don't know anybody who I believe would be offended by that meme, so I don't see a need to make a big deal out of that. EDIT: I wrote the above after reading just the first paragraph. After reading just two more, I have to correct myself: I am disgusted at what the article paints as the most common reaction, that the meme is mostly sexist towards women. Bt! There's so many ways in which that's just a grotesque misrepresentation, most importantly that the man is clearly the "bad guy" in the situation. EDIT 2: The article quotes the company in question: "Everyone who follows the internet and meme culture knows how the meme is used and interpreted. [Whether someone is a] man, woman or neutral gender is often irrelevant in this context. We are an internet company and are conversant in this, as are those who would look for a job with us, so we turned to that target group [...] If we should be punished for anything, it's for using an old and tired meme." It's interesting to see their perspective on things. The sentiment that in the internet it gender is "irrelevant" is ironically the less sexist view of the two, and the fact that they used the chance to state that they are interested in employing people who share that idea was probably a really good idea. It seems like they are showing a giant middle finger to both those who attack them for made up reasons and actual sexists. Brilliant. (Though arguable, the accusations that the meme is sexist towards women is also rather sexist, in that it completely ignores/accepts the image that men are dumb and only act based on their sex drive, have no respect at all for their partners and are the gender that is more likely to cheat)

wutbrodo 8y ago
This is pretty unsurprising, as we're talking about Sweden here. This is the country that stopped gender quotas got universities once they reached 60% women and started getting sued by women who were rejected by programs in favor of ostensibly equally-qualified men. Though it doesn't mesh well with my personal ethics/philosophy, I'm not a die-hard opponent of identity-based tweaks to merit-based systems and think that support in some situations is at least defensible. But Ive seen little to indicate that there's any pretense of intellectual honesty or moral consistency in Sweden's approach to gender politics, beyond simply a special interest group throwing their weight around.
- DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
  It makes me wonder though, what is this even about? Nobody can possibly profit from this directly, so is it to show how much political power a certain movement has? Regardless of what it is, this is just mean and unjust. People are being essentially punished for crimes they didn't commit.

_Codemonkeyism 8y ago

Hurray, this is such a sexist meme against men, glad they recognize that.

DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
Except they didn't (I guess you forgot to add /S ^^)
- _Codemonkeyism 8y ago
  Oh sorry, didn't read the article and jumped to conclusions :-(

dtujmer 8y ago

People get upset about relatively unimportant things. I'm pretty sure sexism exists and is bad, but this is just... not it. It's a dumb meme, that's all.

onion2k 8y ago
It's not really up to you or me to dictate what other people think though, or what they feel is important to them, so the fact you think it's a dumb meme isn't relevant. That's why we have courts.
- sdinsn 8y ago
  Courts shouldn't be wasting their time on this. If courts spent time on every single thing people complained about, nothing important would get done.
  - onion2k 8y ago
    That's why we have levels of courts and people whose job it is to decide whether or not a case has merit based on arguments brought by interested parties. We can't say something is a waste of time just by looking at it. We can't see the nuance at the heart of every matter. Again, it's not for you or me to dictate what is actually important. Not important to you is not the same as being objectively unimportant.
    - iopq 8y ago
      Courts shouldn't have so many resources that they should be looking at things like that for one thing, a use of a meme doesn't infringe on anyone's rights
    - sdinsn 8y ago
      > We can't say something is a waste of time just by looking at it. We sure can.
richmarr 8y ago

Yaa101 8y ago

I really wonder when Sweden is going to prosecute nature...

Double_a_92 8y ago
The point is to punish men for doing "manly" things. The feminist agenda is not some crazy conspiracy theory anymore.

minork 8y ago

If you have not been in war for 200+ years, you can focus on real serious things...

DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
Well, in a way, the fact that this is a problem in 2018 really shows how good our lives are, that we can focus on that kind of ridiculous non-issue.
rasz 8y ago
https://www.thelocal.se/20180508/why-sweden-doesnt-keep-stats-on-ethnic-background-and-crime https://www.thelocal.se/20180508/why-sweden-doesnt-keep-stat... https://www.politico.eu/article/sweden-bombings-grenade-attacks-violent-reality-undoing-peaceful-self-image-law-and-order/ https://www.politico.eu/article/sweden-bombings-grenade-atta... There are no problems when you outlaw reporting them.

hanoz 8y ago

I'm pleased to see that what the people are really concerned about, as defined by this page's popular articles section, is: Swedish road covered in herring after elk accident

rasz 8y ago
this is a more realistic daily occurrence, I will let you guess who the "gang" was and why it wasnt reported: https://www.thelocal.se/20181004/police-officer-assaulted-by-group-in-central-southern-sweden https://www.thelocal.se/20181004/police-officer-assaulted-by...

TomMarius 8y ago

Yeah it is, but against men, what the hell?

talltimtom 8y ago

It’s not sexist neither against men or against women. There are tons of cases of both men and woman having extra marital affairs or cheating. Depicting a situation which is realistic to occur does not have to imply that all woman or all men are anything. If I take a picture of my SO making a sandwich I’m not somehow trying to make implicit assertions about the maternal patriarchy. If that was the case every single picture of overweight men or overweight woman would be “sexist” because they somehow imply everyone of that gender is overweight.

bkor 8y ago
> extra marital affairs or cheating That's not a situation shown in the picture. I find it annoying that it pretends that man are solely focussed on appearance, as if there's no mind or thought in men.
- manicdee 8y ago
  I find it annoying that people pretend the image is about men and not just one man who is about to get a clip over the ear.
DarkWiiPlayer 8y ago
The thing is, those who disagree are not willing to compromise on that. They state as an absolute that any depiction of a gender stereotype reinforces that stereotype in those who are exposed to it and thus keep sexism going. If they stopped believing that premise, their entire argumentation would fall apart, so I doubt it's possible to convince them of that they're wrong.
- teilo 8y ago
  It is not possible to convince them that they are wrong. The denial of gender differences, or even the existence of gender itself, is practically a religious tenet. It does not yield to science or even common sense.

baud147258 8y ago

This story is what, one week old now? Why are talking about it again?

qubax 8y ago

Watchdog groups should only exist for a short period of time and for a specific purpose. If it is open ended, it will inevitable arrive at an extreme. In a sexist society, if I was paying you to find sexism against women, you'd be able to find obvious examples of it. But as society changes and societal sexism against women disappears, what are you left to do? You still have to find examples of sexism to justify your job. Imagine in your quarterly report, you tell your boss there is no more sexism. Well then, your boss might think, well why is your position need any more? But you like your job and the easy paycheck. So you are now incentivized to see sexism where none exists.

bryanlarsen 8y ago

The meme may or may not be sexist on it's own, there are good arguments on both side. When used as part of a job ad? Very different consideration.