4 ms·

But this is data analyzed in 1661, gathered 127 years prior. so its 1 data point from 1 year, tough to make an accurate call on it as variance would be ridiculo

But this is data analyzed in 1661, gathered 127 years prior. so its 1 data point from 1 year, tough to make an accurate call on it as variance would be ridiculously high right? I also did not see any data on sample size, etc. this seems to say life expectancy was ~50 years if you reached 21. https://books.google.com/books?id=T4DLK7zLxYMC&lpg=PP1&pg=PA8#v=onepage&q&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=T4DLK7zLxYMC&lpg=PP1&pg=PA... graunts life table says 33% chance of living to 21. 8.8% of living to 50. Shouldnt it be closer to 16%? if average is 50, means 50% beyond, 50% short. so 50% of 33% would be 16.5%? perhaps Im looking at this wrong

philipkglass 8y ago
That table is for aristocrats only. It contains only men. The table also excludes "those who had died by accidents, violence, poison, or in battle." Admittedly, Tudor England was not a very urbanized society, so looking at Londoners alone is also unrepresentative of the whole nation. I think it is at least a bit broader than 52 noble men who managed not to die of accidents or violence. EDIT: a page later in your source, it also notes "These rates [of death for women] are very high by modern standards... In the 16th and 17th centuries, 11.3% of fertile women died from complications of childbearing."
- sharkmerry 8y ago
  Does Graunt state his sample size? or provide the datasource? I cant find it. seems odd to dismiss the data i provided based on sample size when his data is not even avail for scrutiny. > In the 16th and 17th centuries, 11.3% of fertile women died from complications of childbearing." great, what was the average age of a woman at childbirth? We're discussing mortality after 21 right?
  - philipkglass 8y ago
    According to Graunt's own account, he used London's bills of mortality (weekly records of deaths in in London parishes) that were kept in the parish clerk halls. According to the account beginning on page 51 (as numbered in the scan linked below), the people who collected corpses in London would report to the parish clerk how many people had died and the manner of death. Every Tuesday the reports were compiled, printed on Wednesday, published on Thursday. Graunt claims (page 59) that over a period of 20 years these bills recorded 229,250 deaths. Numbers of births came from records of christenings. Here is a scan of Graunt's book "Natural and Political Observations mentioned in a following Index, and made upon the Bills of Mortality." It is old and a bit hard to read. http://echo.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/ECHOdocuView?url=/permanent/echo/mpi_rostock/Graunt_1665/index.meta&start=51&viewMode=index&pn=59 http://echo.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/ECHOdocuView?url=/permanent/... There is also a transcription of it at Wikisource, but it contains frequent OCR/transcription errors: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Natural_and_Political_Observations_Made_upon_the_Bills_of_Mortality_(Graunt_1676) https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Natural_and_Political_Observa... Average age of a woman at marriage was 23.5, and vast majority of births were to married women, so mother's average age at first childbirth was above 24: https://www.plimoth.org/sites/default/files/media/pdf/edmaterials_demographics.pdf https://www.plimoth.org/sites/default/files/media/pdf/edmate... There appears to be a large collection of the actual bills of mortality scanned and archived here: https://archive.org/details/collectionyearl00hebegoog https://archive.org/details/collectionyearl00hebegoog

philipkglass 8y ago

That table is for aristocrats only. It contains only men. The table also excludes "those who had died by accidents, violence, poison, or in battle." Admittedly, Tudor England was not a very urbanized society, so looking at Londoners alone is also unrepresentative of the whole nation. I think it is at least a bit broader than 52 noble men who managed not to die of accidents or violence. EDIT: a page later in your source, it also notes "These rates [of death for women] are very high by modern standards... In the 16th and 17th centuries, 11.3% of fertile women died from complications of childbearing."

sharkmerry 8y ago
Does Graunt state his sample size? or provide the datasource? I cant find it. seems odd to dismiss the data i provided based on sample size when his data is not even avail for scrutiny. > In the 16th and 17th centuries, 11.3% of fertile women died from complications of childbearing." great, what was the average age of a woman at childbirth? We're discussing mortality after 21 right?
- philipkglass 8y ago
  According to Graunt's own account, he used London's bills of mortality (weekly records of deaths in in London parishes) that were kept in the parish clerk halls. According to the account beginning on page 51 (as numbered in the scan linked below), the people who collected corpses in London would report to the parish clerk how many people had died and the manner of death. Every Tuesday the reports were compiled, printed on Wednesday, published on Thursday. Graunt claims (page 59) that over a period of 20 years these bills recorded 229,250 deaths. Numbers of births came from records of christenings. Here is a scan of Graunt's book "Natural and Political Observations mentioned in a following Index, and made upon the Bills of Mortality." It is old and a bit hard to read. http://echo.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/ECHOdocuView?url=/permanent/echo/mpi_rostock/Graunt_1665/index.meta&start=51&viewMode=index&pn=59 http://echo.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/ECHOdocuView?url=/permanent/... There is also a transcription of it at Wikisource, but it contains frequent OCR/transcription errors: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Natural_and_Political_Observations_Made_upon_the_Bills_of_Mortality_(Graunt_1676) https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Natural_and_Political_Observa... Average age of a woman at marriage was 23.5, and vast majority of births were to married women, so mother's average age at first childbirth was above 24: https://www.plimoth.org/sites/default/files/media/pdf/edmaterials_demographics.pdf https://www.plimoth.org/sites/default/files/media/pdf/edmate... There appears to be a large collection of the actual bills of mortality scanned and archived here: https://archive.org/details/collectionyearl00hebegoog https://archive.org/details/collectionyearl00hebegoog