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I really think this kubernetes is complex meme needs to die. I mean, sure, kubernetes _is_ complex. But it's complex in the way that using Rails is more compl

I really think this kubernetes is complex meme needs to die. I mean, sure, kubernetes _is_ complex. But it's complex in the way that using Rails is more complex than pure Ruby. It's fine when you're playing, or you have a weird subset of problems where you don't care if someone runs or not, but as soon as you deal with the problems of HA, DR, live deployments, secret management, sharing servers, working in a team, etc then if you're solving these issues with ansible and terraform, you're probably just inventing something as complex, and worse, bespoke to your problem. At the end of the day, once you've learned to use kube, it's probably no worse than any other configuration as code based system, and the question is which of us should be learning it and when, and which of us should just be using higher levels of abstractions like gitlabs autodevops. Now, indeed, if you're just hacking and you have no need for a CI and CD pipeline, or reproducibility, etc, then sure, it's probably not the time to learn a hosting framework, but once you do know it, you're free to make an informed opinion on your problem. Personally, I sell kube a lot, but I tend to work for orgs that have several development teams and several apps, and bringing them to a platform seems like a good idea. The question is, should I also put a startup on GKE, or should I do something bespoke where they can't hire another contractor to take over as easily? Personally, I'd go GKE.

raesene9 8y ago
Managed k8s (e.g. GKE) and unmanaged k8s (e.g. kops/kubeadm etc) aren't really the same thing in terms of complexity. GKE takes a lot of the load off by making it Google's problem. The possible downside (which may or may not matter depending on use case) is that you're tied to what Google's control plane provides. So if you want a shiney admission controller, you're out of luck unless they support it. But for basic workloads, it's likely to work well and their management solves a lot of vanilla k8s pain points.
- peterwwillis 8y ago
  This. It's perfectly fine to use GKE or AWS. Trying to set up your own cloud provider for a small project? Crazy. The amount of hours you have to spend learning how k8s works just to set it up properly from scratch will far exceed the r&d and operational cost of a less sophisticated small project set up from scratch. Pay for managed services, or do it as simple as possible.
dsumenkovic 8y ago
Hello, Community Advocate from GitLab here. Thanks for mentioning our Auto DevOps. One of it's main functionalities is to eliminate the complexities of getting going with automated software delivery by automatically setting up the pipeline and necessary integrations, freeing up yourself to focus on the culture part. That means everyone can skip the manual work of configuration, and focus on the creative and human aspects of software creation. Here's the doc with more info about it https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/topics/autodevops/ https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/topics/autodevops/
- ownagefool 8y ago
  You also give us a kubernetes chart that makes it a 5 minute task to install your own gitlab. Jobs actually run in their own kubernetes pods, and since this is seperate to the master, it helps go a long way to actually having something that resembles a secure SCM, CI and CD. I don't work for for gitlab, just someone who steals their hard work and sells it to clients. :)

raesene9 8y ago

Managed k8s (e.g. GKE) and unmanaged k8s (e.g. kops/kubeadm etc) aren't really the same thing in terms of complexity. GKE takes a lot of the load off by making it Google's problem. The possible downside (which may or may not matter depending on use case) is that you're tied to what Google's control plane provides. So if you want a shiney admission controller, you're out of luck unless they support it. But for basic workloads, it's likely to work well and their management solves a lot of vanilla k8s pain points.

peterwwillis 8y ago
This. It's perfectly fine to use GKE or AWS. Trying to set up your own cloud provider for a small project? Crazy. The amount of hours you have to spend learning how k8s works just to set it up properly from scratch will far exceed the r&d and operational cost of a less sophisticated small project set up from scratch. Pay for managed services, or do it as simple as possible.

dsumenkovic 8y ago

Hello, Community Advocate from GitLab here. Thanks for mentioning our Auto DevOps. One of it's main functionalities is to eliminate the complexities of getting going with automated software delivery by automatically setting up the pipeline and necessary integrations, freeing up yourself to focus on the culture part. That means everyone can skip the manual work of configuration, and focus on the creative and human aspects of software creation. Here's the doc with more info about it https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/topics/autodevops/ https://docs.gitlab.com/ee/topics/autodevops/

ownagefool 8y ago
You also give us a kubernetes chart that makes it a 5 minute task to install your own gitlab. Jobs actually run in their own kubernetes pods, and since this is seperate to the master, it helps go a long way to actually having something that resembles a secure SCM, CI and CD. I don't work for for gitlab, just someone who steals their hard work and sells it to clients. :)