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> Chip designers fear that a foundry contracted to make 1 million chips for a designer might instead make 2 million and secretly sell the other half themselves,

> Chip designers fear that a foundry contracted to make 1 million chips for a designer might instead make 2 million and secretly sell the other half themselves, explains Winkler. Is there any documented case of this for a reasonably complicated chip? I can't conceive of a situation where the risk would be worth it for the subset of customers it would even be possible for.

tyingq 8y ago
There's certainly lots of documented cases of counterfeit versions of complex chips. Not the same thing, but does show the environment for this kind of activity exists.
- kingosticks 8y ago
  Yeh, with the difference being that it wouldn't be the foundry doing that. If you can't trust your fab you are dead in the water.
  - tyingq 8y ago
    It does seem to happen now and again: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/06/26/dram_technology_thievery_by_taiwanese_tech_co/ https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/06/26/dram_technology_thi... https://www.techpowerup.com/245790/chinese-dram-companies-stealing-dram-ip-from-samsung-and-sk-hynix https://www.techpowerup.com/245790/chinese-dram-companies-st...
pjc50 8y ago
It's extremely hard to document because the chips tend not to have unique identifiers, and since they all come from the same factory they're all "real". The best investigation I've seen is https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?page_id=1022 https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?page_id=1022 on fake SD cards.
Symmetry 8y ago
After the Kinect came out it took the robotics world by storm as a cheap effective 3D sensor. Later they started making a dedicated version for robots. Then Apple bought the company for the technology that would later turn into being able to unlock your phone with your face. But at the same time they cut off all production of the robotics sensors because it wasn't part of their mission. Thankfully for robotics research you can, if you know where to look, still find these sensors being manufactured in China.

tyingq 8y ago

There's certainly lots of documented cases of counterfeit versions of complex chips. Not the same thing, but does show the environment for this kind of activity exists.

kingosticks 8y ago
Yeh, with the difference being that it wouldn't be the foundry doing that. If you can't trust your fab you are dead in the water.
- tyingq 8y ago
  It does seem to happen now and again: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/06/26/dram_technology_thievery_by_taiwanese_tech_co/ https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/06/26/dram_technology_thi... https://www.techpowerup.com/245790/chinese-dram-companies-stealing-dram-ip-from-samsung-and-sk-hynix https://www.techpowerup.com/245790/chinese-dram-companies-st...

pjc50 8y ago

It's extremely hard to document because the chips tend not to have unique identifiers, and since they all come from the same factory they're all "real". The best investigation I've seen is https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?page_id=1022 https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?page_id=1022 on fake SD cards.

Symmetry 8y ago

After the Kinect came out it took the robotics world by storm as a cheap effective 3D sensor. Later they started making a dedicated version for robots. Then Apple bought the company for the technology that would later turn into being able to unlock your phone with your face. But at the same time they cut off all production of the robotics sensors because it wasn't part of their mission. Thankfully for robotics research you can, if you know where to look, still find these sensors being manufactured in China.