5 ms·

What are you reading exactly? Here's what I posted, it's short: > Oh yea? Stop stealing 30% of my income if you really want to be helpful. That means a ~30% l

What are you reading exactly? Here's what I posted, it's short: > Oh yea? Stop stealing 30% of my income if you really want to be helpful. That means a ~30% levy on middle class income is pretty outrageous if that is the class of people you are intending to help. And the income tax is hardly the only federal tax. The state income tax is relatively minor compared to federal, and roads are funded via gas taxes and tolls, i.e. use taxes, which is far more direct in figuring out where your money is going. Sure the feds will kick in grants to assist with roads et al, but if that were all they were spending their income tax haul on they would not need such a high percentage to begin with. And to be clear, all taxes are confiscatory, by definition. If you don't pay you risk going to jail, and if you resist that it will be at gunpoint. Whether one thinks that confiscation is reasonable and beneficial overall is another issue. But it's not like you can just opt-out of taxes, or death.

AnimalMuppet 8y ago
I certainly read "stop stealing 30% of my income" as saying that: - the government takes 30% of my income, and - that's stealing. To many of us, that was the plain meaning of your exact words. "All taxation is stealing" seemed the clear not-quite-stated implication. > And to be clear, all taxes are confiscatory, by definition. Which definition? dictionary.com says: > 1. to seize as forfeited to the public domain; appropriate, by way of penalty, for public use. > 2. to seize by or as if by authority; appropriate summarily. The first (primary) definition has an element of forfeiture or penalty; the second does not. All taxes are confiscatory by the second definition; not by the first. When you say "all taxes are confiscatory", people are apt to hear "confiscatory" in the first sense, which makes your statement wrong by definition. It also may make it claiming more than you intended it to claim.
- wahern 8y ago
  A better alternative definition is provided by thefreedictionary.com: "2. Being or imposing an excessive or unreasonable tax or cost: confiscatory taxes; a confiscatory police." If you Google the terms "confiscatory taxation" this is the typical denotation.
- furgooswft13 8y ago
  I really think you are splitting hairs with these definitions. Different dictionaries have different phrasings of definitions and different "primary" ones. Most talk about taking property or appropriation by authority/government, which is exactly what taxes are. This is all besides the point, because what I mean when I say "stealing" is "the government is taking a large portion of my income and I am receiving little to no benefit from it, and yet I am not allowed to stop paying for the lack of return for my money. In fact the first link for "confiscatory" on google provides the definition "Being or imposing an excessive or unreasonable tax or cost". That's what I see the federal income tax on the middle class as, excessive and unreasonable. Not that all taxes are necessarily bad, but that one, and the sheer amount it confiscates, certainly is.
  - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
    If the claim is "the federal government is too big and expensive", then I agree with you. I think many people do. Even more would agree with you if the taxes were actually high enough to pay for all this government, instead of running a deficit every year.
    - furgooswft13 8y ago
      It can be both, and is.
dlp211 8y ago
There is no way you are taxed 30% by the IRS and can be considered middle class.

AnimalMuppet 8y ago

I certainly read "stop stealing 30% of my income" as saying that: - the government takes 30% of my income, and - that's stealing. To many of us, that was the plain meaning of your exact words. "All taxation is stealing" seemed the clear not-quite-stated implication. > And to be clear, all taxes are confiscatory, by definition. Which definition? dictionary.com says: > 1. to seize as forfeited to the public domain; appropriate, by way of penalty, for public use. > 2. to seize by or as if by authority; appropriate summarily. The first (primary) definition has an element of forfeiture or penalty; the second does not. All taxes are confiscatory by the second definition; not by the first. When you say "all taxes are confiscatory", people are apt to hear "confiscatory" in the first sense, which makes your statement wrong by definition. It also may make it claiming more than you intended it to claim.

wahern 8y ago
A better alternative definition is provided by thefreedictionary.com: "2. Being or imposing an excessive or unreasonable tax or cost: confiscatory taxes; a confiscatory police." If you Google the terms "confiscatory taxation" this is the typical denotation.
furgooswft13 8y ago
I really think you are splitting hairs with these definitions. Different dictionaries have different phrasings of definitions and different "primary" ones. Most talk about taking property or appropriation by authority/government, which is exactly what taxes are. This is all besides the point, because what I mean when I say "stealing" is "the government is taking a large portion of my income and I am receiving little to no benefit from it, and yet I am not allowed to stop paying for the lack of return for my money. In fact the first link for "confiscatory" on google provides the definition "Being or imposing an excessive or unreasonable tax or cost". That's what I see the federal income tax on the middle class as, excessive and unreasonable. Not that all taxes are necessarily bad, but that one, and the sheer amount it confiscates, certainly is.
- AnimalMuppet 8y ago
  If the claim is "the federal government is too big and expensive", then I agree with you. I think many people do. Even more would agree with you if the taxes were actually high enough to pay for all this government, instead of running a deficit every year.
  - furgooswft13 8y ago
    It can be both, and is.

dlp211 8y ago

There is no way you are taxed 30% by the IRS and can be considered middle class.