7 ms·
Project Atlas
- anc84 8y ago> Project Atlas will connect the BitTorrent peer-to-peer network and the TRON blockchain network via a set of bittorrent protocol extensions, a custom token, and an in-client token economy to address existing limitations and open a new borderless economy for exchanging value for computer resources on a global scale. I prefer the currencies of goodwill, altruism and data hoarding to provide humanity with access to media.
- ekianjo 8y agoThey are not exclusive to each other.
- jypepin 8y agoI agree, but isn't this the current system, which flaws (too many leechers not enough seeders) this project is trying to solve?
- anc84 8y agoI have not seen that flaw in ages as I am part of communities where giving and taking is rewarded with nothing but meaningless points and merit. It works fine.
- jypepin 8y agoI'm sure. I personally never been part of communities more or less because of laziness, but I could see that if this is something getting embedded into the clients directly, it could be a solution.
- anc84 8y agoAdding money to this would easily kill the good intentions of people involved. I don't think it is a right idea.
- jypepin 8y agobut it's not money tho. You get tokens that you can only use on the torrent network, I think to have more seed powers. Kind of like if you could use your karma you've accumulated on your torrent community to get better seeds. I don't think it'd be a bad idea, as it would push more people to seed. I know I'd seed more :)
- anc84 8y agoThat already exists with bonuspoints within torrent communities. It works well. This Atlas thing is all about extracting real money. The owner of BitTorrent Inc is a cryptocoin scammer.
- badge 8y agoIt's been a solved problem in private tracker communities - where users leach bandwidth is on a credit system and they need to maintain a ratio of upload/download to keep their access. What TRON is trying to do is sell tokens to users to be able to access bandwidth. Where do these tokens come from to begin with? TRON just whips them up for free. If I remember right, a famous Bittorrent group based out of the UK called Oink was shut down because they took donations for running the site. One can imagine the same fate would await TRON once the tokens are found facilitating pirated MPAA and copyright IP works.
- DavidNielsen 8y agoI’d posit that such a setup will lead to users with low speed connection or connections which aren’t online constantly to be banned or required to buy a pardon from the site when not fulfilling the seeding requirement (as every site policy I’ve seen required maintaining a ratio over time). This happens because users with high speed connections are incentivized to seed well beyond 1:1 and thus there is rarely any demand for seeding. Downloading is super fast which just exasperates the problem as your share ratio drops below the acceptable rate quickly. Thus such sites tend to make their money off the people who can likely afford it the least, while rewarding people with the disposable income required to live in a neighborhood with unlimited high speed internet and pay for said service. There’s also the matter of keeping content alive to consider. I’d consider it much more valuable to keep content with no or relatively few seeders alive than incentivizing seeders to add additional bandwidth to already popular torrents. I has not seen an site policy which encourages this, rather it likely punishes such activities as it bans users who are trying to reach a required share ratio without constant demand thus taking the content offline rather than keeping it available. Whether or not Project Atlas will enable incentives for all users and multiple scenarios or if it will simply perpetuate a similar system to what is seen in the private torrenting communities remains to be seen.
- jypepin 8y agoOk I stand corrected, thanks for the detailed answer.
- distantsounds 8y agoprivate trackers have been implementing a solution for over a decade that this project seemingly does on a rudimentary level: 'bonus points' for seeding a file after snatching it, which accrues the longer you help seed. the points can be spent however the tracker software is written, be it profile/forum customizations, additional access, or reclaiming ratio.
- ndnxhs 8y agoIn demand content always has plenty of seeders. The stuff that dies is obscure content or large archives. Someone only cares about the data once a year when doing research or something. This network won't solve this because there is no profit in storing data that is very rarely archived. Its a hard problem because you need to rank data on how valuable it is. A dump of GeoCities is rarely used but has great value. A 1tb archive of videos of me counting grains of sand is also rarely used but worthless.
- ndnxhs 8y agoIs it just me or is scrolling broken on mobile?
- fazilakhtar 8y agoWorks fine in the in-app browser of “Hacker News” on iOS
- chupasaurus 8y agoThe only browser engine allowed on iOS is Safari's.
- pedrogpimenta 8y agoFor Firefox on Android, it's broken for me too.
- patrickaljord 8y agoWith cheap music streaming services such as spotify, apple music and google play as well as video streaming such as netflix and amazon, does anyone need bittorrent anymore? At least in first world countries? Besides, bittorrent works great as is, if people start making money on seeding, they will be way easier targets in court when sued by majors. What's the advantage here?
- Cthulhu_ 8y agoYou're falsely assuming bittorrent is only good for piracy. It's ideal for distributing larger - legitimate - files, such as games and game updates, which can easily be 50 - 100 GB. While those could be served by e.g. a cloud edge provider, the publisher would still have to pay per GB. Offloading that load to multiple host locations and clients will save a lot of money and network capacity. Imagine a game on launch day that has been bought a million times - not a stretch of the imagination. That's a hundred petabytes of data that has to be distributed across the world on launch day for a 100 GB game.
- wklauss 8y agoFor large legitimate files, services like WeTransfer or Dropbox have made BitTorrent not really that useful anymore. Cloud storage prices keep going down, as well. As for games, it's uncommon to solve distribution this way. Usually your game will be in one of the big platforms, like Steam. Use cases for BitTorrent have narrowed quite a bit. There are still some uses, sure, but it's not like it used to be.
- IMTDb 8y agoIn 2016 Netflix only offered 31 of the top 250 IMDb movies. Don't know where we are now, but in my country I am surprised when a movie I want to watch is available on Netflix. People do not make money on seeding, they gain internet points, aka coins. The advantage here is that the protocol itself will incentivise people to seed instead of doing a hit & run, and will thus increase the value of the network. Not sure it will work, but the experiment is interesting.
- 8y ago
- pmontra 8y agoFirefox doesn't like the site: > The resource at “https://s3.amazonaws.com/downloads.mailchimp.com/js/mc-validate.js” https://s3.amazonaws.com/downloads.mailchimp.com/js/mc-valid... was blocked because tracking protection is enabled.
- sktrdie 8y ago"Project Atlas will connect the BitTorrent peer-to-peer network and the TRON blockchain network via a set of bittorrent protocol extensions, a custom token, and an in-client token economy to address existing limitations and open a new borderless economy for exchanging value for computer resources on a global scale." How did we get to the point where words simply don't mean anything anymore?
- bryanrasmussen 8y agoby paying exorbitant amounts for bullshit.
- PurpleRamen 8y agoNow you know how the average person feels when reading something nerdy. Just say they twisted some magic streams and marshmallow-man happend.
- TeMPOraL 8y agoYes and no. I think even an average Joe or Jane will quickly notice that "nerdy words" usually have pretty specific (if complex) meanings, whereas this... this is just mostly line noise.
- r3bl 8y agoYou can learn the nerdy things and understand what you're reading. No amount of learning will lead you to understanding bullshit like this.
- joeblau 8y agoThe video[1] does sliglty a lot better job of explaining what's going on. [1] - https://youtu.be/n_BA8tUlRLA?t=63 https://youtu.be/n_BA8tUlRLA?t=63
- snaky 8y agoYou mean proactive award winning innovative solutions leveraging state of the art leading technologies don't engage with industry standard customer expectations on value proposition, or what?
- koalalorenzo 8y agoWhat happened to IPFS and Filecoin? Project Atlas seems to be bad copy of that since it is very much connected with TRON scam: https://twitter.com/juanbenet/status/950142785373405184 https://twitter.com/juanbenet/status/950142785373405184
- sschueller 8y agoAnd Filecoin is not a "scam"? So far there has been no proof that "proof of replication" and "proof of spacetime" is even possible.
- konschubert 8y agoCan you point me to some resources on this topic. Would be quite interesting for me.
- VMG 8y agoThe burden of proof is on those who claim it works
- giancarlostoro 8y agoHere's Proof of Spacetime: https://filecoin.io/filecoin.pdf https://filecoin.io/filecoin.pdf and here's Proof of Replication: https://filecoin.io/proof-of-replication.pdf https://filecoin.io/proof-of-replication.pdf
- qwerty456127 8y agoI've waited for about half a minute and the page still doesn't display anything but just loads my CPU (I have retried a number of times with no luck).
- mabbo 8y agoI can load it on mobile, but it won't let me scroll down to read more than the first half sentence.
- superasn 8y agoYeah same here on android chrome. How can something so simple as a blog post can have so many problems just rendering?
- giancarlostoro 8y agoAny marketing blog posts / pages should always be (cached) static HTML. Helps a lot if you don't have to render content that will remain mostly static to thousands upon thousands of visitors instead of just fetching a file and returning that.
- uptown 8y agoCongratulations. You’ve just joined the new borderless economy for exchanging value for computer resources on a global scale.
- chippy 8y agoThere's some delay and/or timeout related to the huge amount of tracking scripts they include.
- qwerty456127 8y ago30 seconds should be far more than enough in whatever a case. Needless to say I have all the tracking scripts possible blocked as, probably, almost everybody else on HN.
- holstvoogd 8y agoGreat website, doesn't load with an ad blocker enabled. Fucking late stage ad tech..
- ValleyOfTheMtns 8y agoI use uBlock in Chrome and it seems to load fine.
- fifnir 8y agoLoaded just fine for me on Firefox with uBlock origin
- ObsoleteNerd 8y agoLoads but can't scroll at all on Firefox Android, making it completely useless. Not exactly confidence inspiring.
- algorithm_dk 8y agocannot scroll on chrome (android) either
- nevi-me 8y agoUse Desktop mode, someone didn't check whether the website loads properly. Also had the same problem with Chrome on Android
- chippy 8y agoIt loads but it takes the same amount of time to start that Gmail does.
- Svenskunganka 8y agoIt loads, it just has a display: none; on the body that you need to remove with the browser inspector.
- bjoli 8y agoI have same problem. FF mobile and uBlock origin. Seeing the fluff the page contains in the top comment made me think I didnt miss much.
- vijay_nair 8y agoLooks similar to http://joystream.co http://joystream.co which has been paying users with BCH for the past few months.
- dylkil 8y agowould much rather use bitcoin cash over a tron backed token. Tron is nothing more than a pump and dump with a pagiarised whitepaper.
- hakanito 8y agoTRON is the greatest scam the world has seen. Justin Sun hyped the price to unreal levels without a product, then sold at the height around new years ’17/18. Bought BitTorrent with the money. I’d stay far away from TRON
- badge 8y agohttps://www.trustnodes.com/2018/01/08/trons-whitepaper-copied-plagiarized https://www.trustnodes.com/2018/01/08/trons-whitepaper-copie... It's amazing that such a clearly fraudulent project acquired any funding to begin with.
- asenna 8y agoI was just coming here to say the same. I can't believe anything positive related to Tron is on top of HN. It is a very well documented scam and obvious scam.
- MrEldritch 8y agoI wouldn't say "greatest scam the world has seen"; that's really selling the grand history of scams short. TRON may have been profitable, but it was not terribly clever or high-effort; the crypto-speculation space was just abnormally high in unreasonably-enthusiastic suckers.
- hakanito 8y agoFair enough, but TRON created $14B out of thin air.
- badge 8y ago"$14B" on paper - but the real value of what could be extracted from market sells would be immensely less. Those numbers are based on the market spot price, and not the order book support from real world buyers. Cryptocoin exchanges are mostly bots and the order books are mostly loaded with spoofed bids that are pulled away once real buyers and sellers start pushing one way or the other, hence the volatility.
- deleted 8y ago
- self 8y agoBack in the day, Mojo Nation (one of Bittorrent's ancestors -- sort of) incentivized people for sharing their disk space and network bandwidth. You'd earn "mojo" for doing that, and could trade it for faster downloads. An interview: https://www.salon.com/2000/10/09/mojo_nation/ https://www.salon.com/2000/10/09/mojo_nation/
- NPChar 8y agoThe entire page must be an advertisement... it is rendered as blank white page (uBlock Origin).
- capdotnet2 8y agoIt avoids saying pay for files, I feel like the music/media industry’s lawyers would have a fieldday with anyone using this to “share” music files
- xori 8y agoNice, not even 4 months after releasing this. http://blog.bittorrent.com/2018/06/19/user-message/ http://blog.bittorrent.com/2018/06/19/user-message/