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Wow. Learning about cases like this makes me wish I trained to be a lawyer just so I understood exactly how weird law really is.

gerash 8y ago
There is so much emphasis placed on precedent in the US justice system and I don't understand why. With that line of argument I could also argue anything you do or say within the confines of your house is also public's business because it affects the public ultimately one way or another.
- blihp 8y ago
  There's a lot of value placed on consistency and predictability both in civil and criminal law. If the law were arbitrary, then there really is no single set of rules that apply equally to everyone. So when a court decides X in a given case, any other parties going to a court in the same jurisdiction with the same set of facts and circumstances expects the case to be decided in a similar way. Of course, that's the perfect world theory and caveats apply.
  - saalweachter 8y ago
    I would emphasize "any other parties": one of the goals is that if I or if someone who is rich, famous or influential were to be defendants in court cases with similar facts, we would receive similar judgements - who the defendant is shouldn't matter, and paying attention to relevant precedents helps ensure that. I would also mention that the internet tends to misuse precedent in the same way, well, the internet misuses logical fallacies. Finding a precedent you think is applicable to a court case doesn't mean the verdict is decided. Both sides, assuming they have competent lawyers, will submit numerous precedents they believe favors their side, after all. It is up to the courts to decide whether the precedents are applicable and whether to apply the precedent in any give case; precedents inform the court, they do not replace it.
- gnode 8y ago
  Because the US justice system inherits from English common law. The moral motivation is that it is unfair to judge equivalent cases differently. This contrasts with civil law systems, used predominantly throughout mainland Europe / ex-Roman empire, which have the moral motivation that explicit codification of the law is the best way to be fair.
  - wahern 8y ago
    Civil Law systems have a doctrine similar to stare decisis with the same logic--fairness in outcomes. It just operates differently because of different views about the structure of government. I think the main reason that Civil Law systems have voiced opposition to judge-made law is because since their advent (French Revolution onward) Continental systems have emphasized democratic control and thus the supremacy of the legislature, whereas Anglo-American law historically emphasized (or reflected) competing power structures. An early French constitution made it criminal for a judge to "invent" a rule to settle a case; if the law was ambiguous the judge was supposed to refer the case to the legislature. But guess how many times a court declared a law ambiguous and referred it to the legislature? (Point being, Civil Law systems noisily refuted the legitimacy of judge-made law, but the reality was different.) It's notable that Parliamentary Supremacy didn't completely solidify in Britain until the late 1700s. American law didn't inherit such a notion of unlimited legislative authority. The concept of Substantive Due Process emerges from this environment, as does the far less controversial Judicial Review (from Marbury v Madison). Also, FWIW, there's a common misconception (even among lawyers) that the Civil Law is somehow more closely related to Roman Law than the Common Law. That's not really true. Roman Law actually had judge-made law and something like stare decisis, though the technical details were quite different. Emperor Justinian attempted to impose reforms, but these were widely opposed and occurred at the tail end of the Roman Empire. In as much as the Civil Law was based on interpretations of the Justinian Code, that doesn't mean it was reflective of actual Roman Law. And in any event, most of the major distinctions between the Civil Law and Common Law emerged long after misinterpretations of Roman Law had permeated everybody's legal thinking.
    - gnode 8y ago
      Interesting. > American law didn't inherit such a notion of unlimited legislative authority. I wonder if this is due to US's structure being that of a constitutional republic rather than a democratic republic. I.e. the Supreme Court (which executes the constitution) must be superior to the legislature.

gerash 8y ago

There is so much emphasis placed on precedent in the US justice system and I don't understand why. With that line of argument I could also argue anything you do or say within the confines of your house is also public's business because it affects the public ultimately one way or another.

blihp 8y ago
There's a lot of value placed on consistency and predictability both in civil and criminal law. If the law were arbitrary, then there really is no single set of rules that apply equally to everyone. So when a court decides X in a given case, any other parties going to a court in the same jurisdiction with the same set of facts and circumstances expects the case to be decided in a similar way. Of course, that's the perfect world theory and caveats apply.
- saalweachter 8y ago
  I would emphasize "any other parties": one of the goals is that if I or if someone who is rich, famous or influential were to be defendants in court cases with similar facts, we would receive similar judgements - who the defendant is shouldn't matter, and paying attention to relevant precedents helps ensure that. I would also mention that the internet tends to misuse precedent in the same way, well, the internet misuses logical fallacies. Finding a precedent you think is applicable to a court case doesn't mean the verdict is decided. Both sides, assuming they have competent lawyers, will submit numerous precedents they believe favors their side, after all. It is up to the courts to decide whether the precedents are applicable and whether to apply the precedent in any give case; precedents inform the court, they do not replace it.
gnode 8y ago
Because the US justice system inherits from English common law. The moral motivation is that it is unfair to judge equivalent cases differently. This contrasts with civil law systems, used predominantly throughout mainland Europe / ex-Roman empire, which have the moral motivation that explicit codification of the law is the best way to be fair.
- wahern 8y ago
  Civil Law systems have a doctrine similar to stare decisis with the same logic--fairness in outcomes. It just operates differently because of different views about the structure of government. I think the main reason that Civil Law systems have voiced opposition to judge-made law is because since their advent (French Revolution onward) Continental systems have emphasized democratic control and thus the supremacy of the legislature, whereas Anglo-American law historically emphasized (or reflected) competing power structures. An early French constitution made it criminal for a judge to "invent" a rule to settle a case; if the law was ambiguous the judge was supposed to refer the case to the legislature. But guess how many times a court declared a law ambiguous and referred it to the legislature? (Point being, Civil Law systems noisily refuted the legitimacy of judge-made law, but the reality was different.) It's notable that Parliamentary Supremacy didn't completely solidify in Britain until the late 1700s. American law didn't inherit such a notion of unlimited legislative authority. The concept of Substantive Due Process emerges from this environment, as does the far less controversial Judicial Review (from Marbury v Madison). Also, FWIW, there's a common misconception (even among lawyers) that the Civil Law is somehow more closely related to Roman Law than the Common Law. That's not really true. Roman Law actually had judge-made law and something like stare decisis, though the technical details were quite different. Emperor Justinian attempted to impose reforms, but these were widely opposed and occurred at the tail end of the Roman Empire. In as much as the Civil Law was based on interpretations of the Justinian Code, that doesn't mean it was reflective of actual Roman Law. And in any event, most of the major distinctions between the Civil Law and Common Law emerged long after misinterpretations of Roman Law had permeated everybody's legal thinking.
  - gnode 8y ago
    Interesting. > American law didn't inherit such a notion of unlimited legislative authority. I wonder if this is due to US's structure being that of a constitutional republic rather than a democratic republic. I.e. the Supreme Court (which executes the constitution) must be superior to the legislature.