4 ms·

The GOP does not have an ideology. Anything you could name as a position of their ideology they will (and did) betray for either "winning" or at the behest of t

The GOP does not have an ideology. Anything you could name as a position of their ideology they will (and did) betray for either "winning" or at the behest of their corporate masters.

exabrial 8y ago
You left out how both... all political parties cater to special interests but otherwise accurate
- pm90 8y ago
  > all political parties cater to special interests but otherwise accurate Your statement is so broad as to be effectively meaningless. Sun rises in the east. So what? The difference is that the GP is beholden completely to its corporate masters and does not hesitate in engaging in lies, false propaganda and bad faith politics to achieve its goals. All of which are corrupt and very anti-democratic.
  - WillPostForFood 8y ago
    Democrats now get as much money from corporations as Republicans, but no strings attached, eh? https://www.opensecrets.org/overview/sectors.php?cycle=2018 https://www.opensecrets.org/overview/sectors.php?cycle=2018
    - specialist 8y ago
      Whataboutism is so tedious. There are plenty of other contributors, both direct and indirect. PACs, billionaires, unions, earned media, Russians, grandmas, etc.
      - WillPostForFood 8y ago
        On both sides, yes. I'd say the Democrats are more dishonest. GOP claims to be the pro-business party, so no surprise when they act that way. Democrats take the corporate money, pay lip service to the left, and act pro-business as well. Look at Obamacare - we didn't get single payer, we got government subsidies for insurance companies.
        pm90 8y ago
        Obamacare was a compromise precisely because the Democrats had to make it palatable to Republicans. If it was upto Democrats, they would have passed Single Payer.
        amanaplanacanal 8y ago
        Obama was under the illusion that he could reach across the aisle and work with the Republicans, and tried very hard to do something that both sides could support. I think he didn't realize yet that making sure your side has wins, and the other side has losses, is how the game is played now at that level. So after all that, he got no Republican votes. Even thought the plan was, at it's base, a conservative plan. He was naive.
        pm90 8y ago
        Which is really what infuriates me to no end. I'm not saying Obama was perfect, but he was engaging in good-faith dealmaking, hoping to get everyone on board. But the Republicans weren't. And now, everyone seems to think that Mitch McConnell is a super effective Senate leader. But at what cost? Republicans seem to be plagued by a lot of short term thinking... Precisely what the Senate, with its long tenure, was supposed to avoid.
        wolf550e 8y ago
        They believe they are engaged in long term thinking - seize power so completely, popular support and laws cease to matter. Then do to the country what has been done to Toys R Us. And Democrats are willing to let them do it because they think it's a game.
        pm90 8y ago
        This sounds true but is also really depressing. Do you think the popular wave of democrats seeking office this election season will make any difference? I like the energy in the democratic base, but I trust process over people. I fear after the election, people will again lose interest and we'll fall right back where we started.
funkjunky 8y ago
They do have an ideology: fascism. And fascism can be (and has been) defined as a consolidation of power as a reaction to/against "the left" amidst popular enthusiasm and declining support for democratic institutions. By only focusing on the GOP "donor class", you're missing what really connected and drives them. If it was just about donors, then Google, et.al. could have bought out the GOP and swung them to a pro immigrant, pro technology platform fairly easily. But it isn't just about money, it's about various factions of society with a common enemy on "the left" coming together and reacting against whatever it is "the left" represents in that society. This is why it doesn't matter what is said or done one minute vs. the next, or facts, or the law, or democracy, or philosophical/religious morality, etc. It is only about consolidating power at any cost, attacking/undermining anything that represents leftist or democratic institutions and ideologies, and scapegoating allies of the left such as minorities, immigrants, academia, environmentalists, and the media. In this case, "net neutrality" is considered a leftist ideology, much like climate change. Therefore it is imperative that it be destroyed, and it isn't just isps that will fight against it. Here's an entertaining, upsetting, and fairly well researched video (part of series) that goes in depth on it: https://youtu.be/fIN8oxnw__I https://youtu.be/fIN8oxnw__I
- robdachshund 8y ago
  I like how I'm shadowbanned for no apparent reason but you're free to call people fascist on a programming forum.

The GOP does not have an ideology. Anything you could name as a position of their ideology they will (and did) betray for either "winning" or at the behest of their corporate masters.

exabrial 8y ago

You left out how both... all political parties cater to special interests but otherwise accurate

pm90 8y ago
> all political parties cater to special interests but otherwise accurate Your statement is so broad as to be effectively meaningless. Sun rises in the east. So what? The difference is that the GP is beholden completely to its corporate masters and does not hesitate in engaging in lies, false propaganda and bad faith politics to achieve its goals. All of which are corrupt and very anti-democratic.
- WillPostForFood 8y ago
  Democrats now get as much money from corporations as Republicans, but no strings attached, eh? https://www.opensecrets.org/overview/sectors.php?cycle=2018 https://www.opensecrets.org/overview/sectors.php?cycle=2018
  - specialist 8y ago
    Whataboutism is so tedious. There are plenty of other contributors, both direct and indirect. PACs, billionaires, unions, earned media, Russians, grandmas, etc.
    - WillPostForFood 8y ago
      On both sides, yes. I'd say the Democrats are more dishonest. GOP claims to be the pro-business party, so no surprise when they act that way. Democrats take the corporate money, pay lip service to the left, and act pro-business as well. Look at Obamacare - we didn't get single payer, we got government subsidies for insurance companies.
      - pm90 8y ago
        Obamacare was a compromise precisely because the Democrats had to make it palatable to Republicans. If it was upto Democrats, they would have passed Single Payer.
        amanaplanacanal 8y ago
        Obama was under the illusion that he could reach across the aisle and work with the Republicans, and tried very hard to do something that both sides could support. I think he didn't realize yet that making sure your side has wins, and the other side has losses, is how the game is played now at that level. So after all that, he got no Republican votes. Even thought the plan was, at it's base, a conservative plan. He was naive.
        pm90 8y ago
        Which is really what infuriates me to no end. I'm not saying Obama was perfect, but he was engaging in good-faith dealmaking, hoping to get everyone on board. But the Republicans weren't. And now, everyone seems to think that Mitch McConnell is a super effective Senate leader. But at what cost? Republicans seem to be plagued by a lot of short term thinking... Precisely what the Senate, with its long tenure, was supposed to avoid.
        wolf550e 8y ago
        They believe they are engaged in long term thinking - seize power so completely, popular support and laws cease to matter. Then do to the country what has been done to Toys R Us. And Democrats are willing to let them do it because they think it's a game.
        pm90 8y ago
        This sounds true but is also really depressing. Do you think the popular wave of democrats seeking office this election season will make any difference? I like the energy in the democratic base, but I trust process over people. I fear after the election, people will again lose interest and we'll fall right back where we started.

funkjunky 8y ago

They do have an ideology: fascism. And fascism can be (and has been) defined as a consolidation of power as a reaction to/against "the left" amidst popular enthusiasm and declining support for democratic institutions. By only focusing on the GOP "donor class", you're missing what really connected and drives them. If it was just about donors, then Google, et.al. could have bought out the GOP and swung them to a pro immigrant, pro technology platform fairly easily. But it isn't just about money, it's about various factions of society with a common enemy on "the left" coming together and reacting against whatever it is "the left" represents in that society. This is why it doesn't matter what is said or done one minute vs. the next, or facts, or the law, or democracy, or philosophical/religious morality, etc. It is only about consolidating power at any cost, attacking/undermining anything that represents leftist or democratic institutions and ideologies, and scapegoating allies of the left such as minorities, immigrants, academia, environmentalists, and the media. In this case, "net neutrality" is considered a leftist ideology, much like climate change. Therefore it is imperative that it be destroyed, and it isn't just isps that will fight against it. Here's an entertaining, upsetting, and fairly well researched video (part of series) that goes in depth on it: https://youtu.be/fIN8oxnw__I https://youtu.be/fIN8oxnw__I

robdachshund 8y ago
I like how I'm shadowbanned for no apparent reason but you're free to call people fascist on a programming forum.