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I've been trying to build deep tech startups in Germany for 6 years. I managed to sell the first one I built to a US company (for a very small amount of money)

I've been trying to build deep tech startups in Germany for 6 years. I managed to sell the first one I built to a US company (for a very small amount of money) and started afresh after taking a break as an employee. Right now I'm at the point of giving up again because it's so damn hard to find customers here. In my opinion, for deep tech startups the problem is not primarily access to capital but access to customers, as the corporate culture is extremely hostile towards startups. Large corporations are very risk-averse and most of them won't ever consider buying a product from an unproven startup. The ones that want to work with startups often have started their own incubators where they try out ideas by hiring teams and building startups that they fully control (50 % shares belong to the parent company from the beginning). Also, from my experience getting seed funding becomes harder the more experienced you are here: If you just finished university it's easy to get a so-called EXIST grant, which will pay a little more than 100.000 € to fund a team of three people for a year. That's how most (or at least many) of the successful startups get funded here. The thing is, if you have been working for 5 years or more you will be ineligible for that program, and your options for getting seed money are very restricted. This is weird as people with industry experience usually have a much better chance at building something relevant and successful than a recent university graduate with no business experience. They have a much harder time finding money though. There are counterexamples and very successful deep tech startups of course, I just think we could have many more of those if we had a system that actually encouraged and helped people to build these companies. I can understand that many people decide against it, especially when you're a good technician / engineer you can earn much more in industry and there's very little to gain by leaving your position.

jayalpha 8y ago
Agreed. * Lack of capital There is just much less VC available, even if normalized for the difference in size. I know the VC scene a little bit in Germany. Total monkeys. * Lack of attitude Germans are much more hierarchical. Both in science and entrepreneurship I found the American personality much more suited. * Lack of vision You will find money in Germany for a personalized cereal/granola mix shipment service (was just an exapmple, but in fact I think it exits) but if you are into a disruptive technology they will balk. Both have different risks but both also have different pay-offs. Edit: Reasons given due to the downvote
- jayalpha 8y ago
  Why the down-vote? I think I know what I am writing about.
  - yorwba 8y ago
    > Total monkeys.
- hef19898 8y ago
  Your cereal mix service is called Mymüsli. During the time I investigated funding options I was considering to enter a business plan contest. The information given by everyone was that only inovative tech start-ups would be considered. One of the runner ups in the end was a service that allowed you to by food from local farmers, limited to one metropolitan area. I have my doubts that the general start-up ecosystemin germany knows what they are doing.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
Jdam 8y ago
I‘d have been eligible for EXIST, but that program is a bad joke. 100k for 3 persons for one year before tax? C‘mon. That is financial sucide, if you’re in tech these days.
- hef19898 8y ago
  Yeah, and than you have to pass a panel deciding whether your "idea" is innovative enough. It reminded me more of a game of buzzword bingo than a viable investment procedure. As your not allowed to incorporate before enter EXIST it is just a waste of time. Not to mention that it all depends on how well you are connected at your university, and if government funds are available.
  - destartupop 8y ago
    I'd say the chances of getting a grant are very good, back in the day the success rate was around 50 % and you could apply up to three times (to my knowledge), which made it highly likely that you'd get the money if you were persevering. It's true that you have to choose a good university as the quality of the provided coaching and mentorship varies wildly. I can recommend LMU & TU Munich as well as TU Berlin or one of the other well-known technical universities (e.g. RWTH Aachen), to my knowledge they have very good programs. You don't need connections at your university either, you just need to convince a professor to support your application, which they are often happy to do as it counts towards the amount of funding they raised, which is a relevant metric to them. If you can get that money it's really an excellent opportunity and will help you to get further funding, as I said before I just find it sad that nothing comparable exists for experienced people from industry.
    - hef19898 8y ago
      I tried a while back. Not being at one of the universities you mentioned ,I would have been an extension from TU Munich. Funds where hard to come by at that time (right after the elections, so no governmant, no government budget, no EXIST funds). In the end, I talked to all relevant profs at my university, they talked to the giys at TUM, and the feed-back was "no need to tey, your idea is not innovative enough. Try a bank or bet your house." Also the expected time line was around 6 months to get into the program, so for me it would have just been a colosal waste of time. EDIT: While coaching is anive thing, it is access to follow-up funding that matters. At let's be honest in that regard YC is different league all together. And if you don't need funding beyond 100k you really could have used bank in the first place.
sarabande 8y ago
Can you share which deep tech startup companies you find successful in Germany?

jayalpha 8y ago

Agreed. * Lack of capital There is just much less VC available, even if normalized for the difference in size. I know the VC scene a little bit in Germany. Total monkeys. * Lack of attitude Germans are much more hierarchical. Both in science and entrepreneurship I found the American personality much more suited. * Lack of vision You will find money in Germany for a personalized cereal/granola mix shipment service (was just an exapmple, but in fact I think it exits) but if you are into a disruptive technology they will balk. Both have different risks but both also have different pay-offs. Edit: Reasons given due to the downvote

jayalpha 8y ago
Why the down-vote? I think I know what I am writing about.
- yorwba 8y ago
  > Total monkeys.
hef19898 8y ago
Your cereal mix service is called Mymüsli. During the time I investigated funding options I was considering to enter a business plan contest. The information given by everyone was that only inovative tech start-ups would be considered. One of the runner ups in the end was a service that allowed you to by food from local farmers, limited to one metropolitan area. I have my doubts that the general start-up ecosystemin germany knows what they are doing.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

Jdam 8y ago

I‘d have been eligible for EXIST, but that program is a bad joke. 100k for 3 persons for one year before tax? C‘mon. That is financial sucide, if you’re in tech these days.

hef19898 8y ago
Yeah, and than you have to pass a panel deciding whether your "idea" is innovative enough. It reminded me more of a game of buzzword bingo than a viable investment procedure. As your not allowed to incorporate before enter EXIST it is just a waste of time. Not to mention that it all depends on how well you are connected at your university, and if government funds are available.
- destartupop 8y ago
  I'd say the chances of getting a grant are very good, back in the day the success rate was around 50 % and you could apply up to three times (to my knowledge), which made it highly likely that you'd get the money if you were persevering. It's true that you have to choose a good university as the quality of the provided coaching and mentorship varies wildly. I can recommend LMU & TU Munich as well as TU Berlin or one of the other well-known technical universities (e.g. RWTH Aachen), to my knowledge they have very good programs. You don't need connections at your university either, you just need to convince a professor to support your application, which they are often happy to do as it counts towards the amount of funding they raised, which is a relevant metric to them. If you can get that money it's really an excellent opportunity and will help you to get further funding, as I said before I just find it sad that nothing comparable exists for experienced people from industry.
  - hef19898 8y ago
    I tried a while back. Not being at one of the universities you mentioned ,I would have been an extension from TU Munich. Funds where hard to come by at that time (right after the elections, so no governmant, no government budget, no EXIST funds). In the end, I talked to all relevant profs at my university, they talked to the giys at TUM, and the feed-back was "no need to tey, your idea is not innovative enough. Try a bank or bet your house." Also the expected time line was around 6 months to get into the program, so for me it would have just been a colosal waste of time. EDIT: While coaching is anive thing, it is access to follow-up funding that matters. At let's be honest in that regard YC is different league all together. And if you don't need funding beyond 100k you really could have used bank in the first place.

sarabande 8y ago

Can you share which deep tech startup companies you find successful in Germany?