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Why is it necessary to truly avoid exploiting the other party, instead of merely maintaining for them an illusion that they're not being exploited?
by mmirate 8y ago
Why is it necessary to truly avoid exploiting the other party, instead of merely maintaining for them an illusion that they're not being exploited?
- noblethrasher 8y agoBecause doing so desensitizes you to the pain and suffering of others. Maybe a society full of sociopaths can get along just fine, but I'd rather not run that experiment.
- mmirate 8y agoWhy not? Afraid they'll actually get things done instead of faffing about with thefts and handouts and bureaucracy?
- dang 8y agoAt this point you're trolling. Please stop. Please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and follow the rules when posting here.
- pergadad 8y agoMost people are happier if they know that they are actively contributing to the world or at least to others people's happiness. Whether that applies to you is a question you have to answer yourself. I wouldn't want to live my life knowing that I'm trying to pull everyone and everything over the table and that i make others miserable wherever I go. If you want to find a business reason: long term relationships and trust both are valuable and build future business and new connections. But, really, the first reason should be enough.
- mmirate 8y agoBusiness negotiations are one thing. But the goal of a hostage negotiation is generally to waste enough time (and/or agree upon such a maneuver) so that the enemy exposes themselves all to simultaneous incapacitation by well-placed bullets, no?
- lwansbrough 8y agoThe FBI has botched a number of high stakes operations using the tactics you mentioned. Going in weapons hot is really dangerous for everyone involved and much like lawyers with law, the smartest people will seek to minimize their exposure to risk (ie. courtrooms, raids, etc.) A better and cheaper solution in a hostage negotiation is to figure out the core motives for the hostage takers (often money [and why they need it]) and lead them to realistic expectations and a feeling of fairness.
- amalcon 8y agoAssuming this is a serious question, no, it's not. The goal of a hostage negotiation is to secure the safety of the hostages without capitulating to their captors. While arranging a violent solution is one way to do this, and it does sometimes happen, you'd be surprised how often people will simply surrender peacefully.
- beamatronic 8y agoThat’s a really interesting question to consider. If a business uses your skills to make a profit are you being exploited? Does it make a difference if you get free lunch, massages, $300k salary, RSUs? Are you still being exploited? Where’s the line...
- alexcnwy 8y agoAlso remember businesses are taking risk - they may fail in making a profit but your income is (barring them going bankrupt) risk-free. Profit is the risk premium.
- dwaltrip 8y agoWe are social animals that thrive in groups, not as lone individuals. This requires certain social behaviors.
- mmirate 8y agoModern technology has made a mockery of the days when it took an entire family's labor just to raise an acre or two of crops.
- dwaltrip 8y agoI'm talking about the hundreds of thousands of years we spent as tribes of hunter gatherers. We still carry much of the social needs and behaviors formed in that landscape.
- mmirate 8y agoRight, and I'm saying that the landscape has changed enough that many of the behaviors and characteristics we evolved back then, are maladaptive today; just because most humans happen to have a certain trait, does not mean that others should hold that trait sacred and kowtow+mold themselves to it. There are other examples, too; ones with even fewer exceptions. Our minds and bodies both help hoard energy; that trait-set was useful when animals were difficult to hunt, but today it just foments carb-poisoning, obesity and a raft of other pointlessly energy-efficient design tradeoffs. (The modern world is so much more energy-abundant than the ancestral landscape, yet we can't actually make use of anything past ~8 MJ a day for anything but high-endurance physical exertion. A human brain is like a Pentium II hooked up to a 500W PSU.)
- dwaltrip 8y agoThe environment has changed significantly, yes. However, I don't agree that it has changed in ways that make pro-social behavior maladaptive.
- wsy 8y agoThe fact that you engage in this discussion here seems a strong indicator to me that the landscape has not changed that much. Otherwise you would just exploit everybody around you, and not talk about it.
- fsloth 8y agoBecause uncompromisingly compassionate behaviour towards other human beings is the ultimate and best way to make a world better place. Unless you are a billionare and can compete in funding woth nation states.
- mmirate 8y agoIs that supposed to mean something?
- lwansbrough 8y agoIndeed the idea is to make the adversary feel as though they’re getting a fair deal. The risk of exploiting them is that they might find out and now you’ve damaged your own reputation. Forcing the adversary to consider your perspective with empathy will allow them to recognize the unfair aspects of their deal and renegotiate for you. It’s not that you shouldn’t exploit them (though in most cases it’s grately beneficial to both parties if you don’t), it’s that if you’re doing it right, you don’t need to in most cases. There’s always exceptions, but the concept of approaching any deal with a core principle of exploiting the other party is a flawed strategy.
- Thriptic 8y agoBecause typically people figure it out eventually and then they are really angry. At the end of the day, all you really have is your reputation, and you don't want to be known as an exploitative asshole.
- dang 8y agoWe detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18099434 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18099434 and marked it off-topic.