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Interesting tidbit about Winston Churchill. He was the only person in any of the major warring powers to have held high office in both WW 1 and WW 2. In WW 1

by btilly 8y ago

Interesting tidbit about Winston Churchill. He was the only person in any of the major warring powers to have held high office in both WW 1 and WW 2. In WW 1 he was in charge of the British navy (though he did resign after Gallipoli). In WW 2 he, of course, rose to Prime Minister. What is more surprising, perhaps, is that this is a claim that nobody else can make. But when you examine it, it is in the nature of democracy that there is regular turnover of those at the top. This happened in Britain, France and the USA. And the various non-democracies involved all had changes of government between the start of WW 1 and WW 2, which again results in turnover of those at the top. So he became very successful. Whether this was because of, or in spite of, his mother's disappointment is another question. (I would be inclined on general principle to guess "because of", but I don't know enough for an educated opinion.)

robotkdick 8y ago
Thanks for pointing this out. I knew it, but the uniqueness had not been clear. He is an intriguing character and an anomaly in so many ways, and I would say that is because, in large part, of his relationship with his mother, whom he befuddled (like so many others in his life), but she nonetheless adored him.
- btilly 8y ago
  A strong-willed mother can be found behind many famous people. Or at least that was one of the findings in https://www.amazon.com/Cradles-Eminence-Childhoods-Famous-Women/dp/091070757X https://www.amazon.com/Cradles-Eminence-Childhoods-Famous-Wo.... (A book I'm familiar with because my mother read it and applied its lessons in odd ways to her parenting..) That is why on general principle I would expect his mother to likely be a cause for his success.
rfinney 8y ago
Stalin was a leader in the Russian (Soviet) Government late in World War I: "Stalin became part of an informal foursome leading the government, alongside Lenin, Trotsky, and Sverdlov;[183] of these, Sverdlov was regularly absent, and died in March 1919.[184] Stalin's office was based near to Lenin's in the Smolny Institute,[185] and he and Trotsky were the only individuals allowed access to Lenin's study without an appointment." ... Stalin was appointed the People's Commissar for Nationalities. [ date? ] [ from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#Consolidating_power:_1917%E2%80%931918 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#Consolidating_po... ] Franklin Roosevelt also held a relatively high office: Assistant Secretary of the Navy.
- btilly 8y ago
  That was after Russia had departed from the war.
  - philwelch 8y ago
    Although the rest of the Allies hastily invaded Russia in an attempt to overthrow the Bolsheviks--perhaps a bit of a side war to WWI, akin to the Russian invasions of Finland.
  - rfinney 8y ago
    Check: In November, 1917, Vladimir Lenin rewarded Joseph Stalin for his support of the October Revolution by appointing him Commissar of Nationalities. [ source : https://spartacus-educational.com/RUSnationalities.htm https://spartacus-educational.com/RUSnationalities.htm ] The Germans agreed to let the Russians negotiate a peace treaty. Lenin, leader of the Russian revolution, sent Trotsky, his second in command, to the Polish town of Brest-Litovsk to make the negotiations. Trotsky refused the terms of the treaty initially, but had to sign in March 1918 when the German army responded to his delaying tactics by resuming an invasion of Russia. [ source : https://classroom.synonym.com/significance-russian-withdrawal-wwi-5281.html https://classroom.synonym.com/significance-russian-withdrawa... ]
simplicio 8y ago
Petain was Commander and Chief of the French forces in WWI, prime-minister of France during WWII and leader of Vichy France. So not only a major leader in both wars, but in the second war he held high office on both sides! (and FDR was Asst Sec of the Navy in WWI if you count that as a high office)
nabla9 8y ago
Another tidbit about the war. World War goes better when drunk. Churchill and Stalin were alcoholics. Hitler might or might not have Blitzed with coke/opiates and meth.
microtherion 8y ago
This is all the more remarkable as Churchill, whatever his other qualities, demonstrated terrible military judgment in WWI (and, some argue, in WW II as well).

by btilly 8y ago

robotkdick 8y ago

Thanks for pointing this out. I knew it, but the uniqueness had not been clear. He is an intriguing character and an anomaly in so many ways, and I would say that is because, in large part, of his relationship with his mother, whom he befuddled (like so many others in his life), but she nonetheless adored him.

btilly 8y ago
A strong-willed mother can be found behind many famous people. Or at least that was one of the findings in https://www.amazon.com/Cradles-Eminence-Childhoods-Famous-Women/dp/091070757X https://www.amazon.com/Cradles-Eminence-Childhoods-Famous-Wo.... (A book I'm familiar with because my mother read it and applied its lessons in odd ways to her parenting..) That is why on general principle I would expect his mother to likely be a cause for his success.

rfinney 8y ago

Stalin was a leader in the Russian (Soviet) Government late in World War I: "Stalin became part of an informal foursome leading the government, alongside Lenin, Trotsky, and Sverdlov;[183] of these, Sverdlov was regularly absent, and died in March 1919.[184] Stalin's office was based near to Lenin's in the Smolny Institute,[185] and he and Trotsky were the only individuals allowed access to Lenin's study without an appointment." ... Stalin was appointed the People's Commissar for Nationalities. [ date? ] [ from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#Consolidating_power:_1917%E2%80%931918 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#Consolidating_po... ] Franklin Roosevelt also held a relatively high office: Assistant Secretary of the Navy.

btilly 8y ago
That was after Russia had departed from the war.
- philwelch 8y ago
  Although the rest of the Allies hastily invaded Russia in an attempt to overthrow the Bolsheviks--perhaps a bit of a side war to WWI, akin to the Russian invasions of Finland.
- rfinney 8y ago
  Check: In November, 1917, Vladimir Lenin rewarded Joseph Stalin for his support of the October Revolution by appointing him Commissar of Nationalities. [ source : https://spartacus-educational.com/RUSnationalities.htm https://spartacus-educational.com/RUSnationalities.htm ] The Germans agreed to let the Russians negotiate a peace treaty. Lenin, leader of the Russian revolution, sent Trotsky, his second in command, to the Polish town of Brest-Litovsk to make the negotiations. Trotsky refused the terms of the treaty initially, but had to sign in March 1918 when the German army responded to his delaying tactics by resuming an invasion of Russia. [ source : https://classroom.synonym.com/significance-russian-withdrawal-wwi-5281.html https://classroom.synonym.com/significance-russian-withdrawa... ]

simplicio 8y ago

Petain was Commander and Chief of the French forces in WWI, prime-minister of France during WWII and leader of Vichy France. So not only a major leader in both wars, but in the second war he held high office on both sides! (and FDR was Asst Sec of the Navy in WWI if you count that as a high office)

nabla9 8y ago

Another tidbit about the war. World War goes better when drunk. Churchill and Stalin were alcoholics. Hitler might or might not have Blitzed with coke/opiates and meth.

microtherion 8y ago

This is all the more remarkable as Churchill, whatever his other qualities, demonstrated terrible military judgment in WWI (and, some argue, in WW II as well).