3 ms·

half of these arguments are of the Facebook vs. Myspace variety -- or the Yang should be outed argument as well 1. Same could be said for Yahoo vs. Google 2.

by wumi 18y ago

half of these arguments are of the Facebook vs. Myspace variety -- or the Yang should be outed argument as well 1. Same could be said for Yahoo vs. Google 2. Hotmail/Live mail has more users than Gmail (ditto with MSN messenger and Gchat, or Yahoomail/Yahoo messenger vs. Gmail/Gchat) 3. How many years did the iPod have on the Zune? You should be making an argument why Ballmer/ MSFT didn't release a Zune Phone, not comparing the iPod to the Zune. 4. Xbox v. Wii? Are you serious? Wii is heavily targeting a casual gamer market, while Xbox is more geared towards a more hard-core gamer, which is OK. Apples and Oranges. Wii outsells in systems, but not in games -- many dont even buy one game but just play what comes on the system. I've had both the Wii and the Xbox/Xbox 360, btw, and I know many who do, just as I know many who have an Xbox and a PS3 for the game variety (i.e. Gears of War, Halo, Tom Clancy games on one and MGS, FF, etc. on the PS3) Don't know any non-hackers who use Linux. what about synch, surface, or photosynth? You think OSX has Vista beat in the business world? Nice try. Most consumers and businesses buy machines not for the OS, but for the brand name of the machine --- Apple, Dell, HP, etc. so I'm not sure I see how OSX is a big winner over Vista. Gaining market share, sure, but Vista as a non-winner? you obviously dislike MSFT but aren't really making any logical arguments why Ballmer should be outed other than that you prefer competing products.

mattmaroon 18y ago
You're right on number 4. You really can't compare things to the Wii. The Wii is a black swan of sorts. Nintendo is really firing on all cylinders right now. You can't expect MSFT to be able to beat a company entirely focused on gaming, with over 100 years of experience in the industry, in their own arena in that short of a time. In fact, given the number of large companies that have tried and failed to make a dent in the console gaming industry over the last couple decades, the fact that MSFT has become a viable contender in such a short time period is actually quite impressive. The Xbox360 would be my vote for the most intelligent thing they've done in a very long time. They embraced the web before their opponents and did it in a better way with Xbox Live. Features they added first (downloadable games or movies for instance, or the ability to stream media from a computer) are becoming standard elsewhere. In a lot of ways, they're ahead of the curve.
- edw519 18y ago
  "You can't expect MSFT to be able to beat a company entirely focused on gaming" Then why do they continue to insist on doing it? They have "focused" competitors in every market. They compete with google in search. They compete with Oracle in data bases. They compete with SAP in enterprise apps. Except for GE, who has an unfair advantage thanks to your tax dollars, the conglomerate has been dead for 20 years. Is Microsoft still so arrogant that they think they can be the only high tech conglomerate? They became big with a monopoly on the desktop and have long since lost their focus. This is a problem of leadership. The days of the bully are over.
  - mattmaroon 18y ago
    Ha, the old chop the relevant half of the sentence out and argue against the remainder technique. Always a classic in internet debate. How many votes that comment has shows the bias here. The "in that short of a time" part was the qualifier. Microsoft knew going in that they weren't going to take the lead. It's called an investment, and it's the same thing they did with the Zune. Unlike the Zune though, they've captured an impressive amount of market share quickly with the Xbox 360. Even the original console fared well.
    - aston 18y ago
      The analogy you note between the Zune and the Xbox is maybe more similar than you think. People forget the Xbox first came out 2001. It takes years for an investment in a new market like that to get big, even if executed perfectly. I'm interested in seeing how the Zune looks 3-5 years from now. Mostly because I think J. Allard's a genius.
    - edw519 18y ago
      "Ha, the old chop the relevant half of the sentence out and argue against the remainder technique." Isn't that exactly what you did to me, Matt? I started this thread questioning Microsoft's leadership trying to be all things to all people instead of focusing of their core strength. As any shareholder should. I cited a half dozen examples. You and others chose your favorite example and drilled into it. How is that different? What has made this thread so interesting is how many downvotes AND upvotes I keep getting. Microsoft's pretty polarizing, huh? I wonder how many of their employees visit this board. "Always a classic in internet debate." Second only to "That's not fair." Welcome to the world of Microsoft.

by wumi 18y ago

mattmaroon 18y ago

You're right on number 4. You really can't compare things to the Wii. The Wii is a black swan of sorts. Nintendo is really firing on all cylinders right now. You can't expect MSFT to be able to beat a company entirely focused on gaming, with over 100 years of experience in the industry, in their own arena in that short of a time. In fact, given the number of large companies that have tried and failed to make a dent in the console gaming industry over the last couple decades, the fact that MSFT has become a viable contender in such a short time period is actually quite impressive. The Xbox360 would be my vote for the most intelligent thing they've done in a very long time. They embraced the web before their opponents and did it in a better way with Xbox Live. Features they added first (downloadable games or movies for instance, or the ability to stream media from a computer) are becoming standard elsewhere. In a lot of ways, they're ahead of the curve.

edw519 18y ago
"You can't expect MSFT to be able to beat a company entirely focused on gaming" Then why do they continue to insist on doing it? They have "focused" competitors in every market. They compete with google in search. They compete with Oracle in data bases. They compete with SAP in enterprise apps. Except for GE, who has an unfair advantage thanks to your tax dollars, the conglomerate has been dead for 20 years. Is Microsoft still so arrogant that they think they can be the only high tech conglomerate? They became big with a monopoly on the desktop and have long since lost their focus. This is a problem of leadership. The days of the bully are over.
- mattmaroon 18y ago
  Ha, the old chop the relevant half of the sentence out and argue against the remainder technique. Always a classic in internet debate. How many votes that comment has shows the bias here. The "in that short of a time" part was the qualifier. Microsoft knew going in that they weren't going to take the lead. It's called an investment, and it's the same thing they did with the Zune. Unlike the Zune though, they've captured an impressive amount of market share quickly with the Xbox 360. Even the original console fared well.
  - aston 18y ago
    The analogy you note between the Zune and the Xbox is maybe more similar than you think. People forget the Xbox first came out 2001. It takes years for an investment in a new market like that to get big, even if executed perfectly. I'm interested in seeing how the Zune looks 3-5 years from now. Mostly because I think J. Allard's a genius.
  - edw519 18y ago
    "Ha, the old chop the relevant half of the sentence out and argue against the remainder technique." Isn't that exactly what you did to me, Matt? I started this thread questioning Microsoft's leadership trying to be all things to all people instead of focusing of their core strength. As any shareholder should. I cited a half dozen examples. You and others chose your favorite example and drilled into it. How is that different? What has made this thread so interesting is how many downvotes AND upvotes I keep getting. Microsoft's pretty polarizing, huh? I wonder how many of their employees visit this board. "Always a classic in internet debate." Second only to "That's not fair." Welcome to the world of Microsoft.