3 ms·

Curious: don't these people still have to report the arrests in some forms /for some jobs even if they're vacated? "Have you ever been arrested or jailed..." I

Curious: don't these people still have to report the arrests in some forms /for some jobs even if they're vacated? "Have you ever been arrested or jailed..." I know US immigration specifically asks to mention even if pardoned or expunged.

leetcrew 8y ago
not sure what types of jobs would make you answer that question (outside of security maybe), but at least in principle, such questions should be completely illegitimate within the US legal system.
- teh_klev 8y ago
  In Scotland there's a system called "Disclosure"[0]. There are different types of disclosure[1]: - Basic disclosure - Standard disclosure - Enhanced disclosure - Protecting Vulnerable Groups (PVG) Scheme Depending on the level of disclosure, "spent" convictions may need to be disclosed. You can however apply for spent convictions to be removed from the disclosure process. As an employee for a private consultancy which was carrying out software development work for the Scottish Government I had to get a Basic Disclosure to be able to perform my duties on that contract. It's not that unusual for certain types of work. [0]: https://www.mygov.scot/organisations/disclosure-scotland/ https://www.mygov.scot/organisations/disclosure-scotland/ [1]: https://www.mygov.scot/disclosure-types/ https://www.mygov.scot/disclosure-types/
- onetimemanytime 8y ago
  US Visa application: "Have you ever been arrested or convicted for any offense or crime, even though subject of a pardon, amnesty, or other similar action?" https://travel.stackexchange.com/questions/78412/what-should-a-uk-citizen-say-when-applying-for-a-us-visa-if-they-were-arrested-a https://travel.stackexchange.com/questions/78412/what-should... It asks but doesn't mean you're automatically denied. BUT a just pardoned person in Seattle would have to answer yes if Canada asked the same question (they probably do)
Nasrudith 8y ago
Isn't asking just if one has been arrested in an interview for nonlaw enforcement positions technically an illegal question without qualifiers to specifically exclude the ones that didn't result in conviction or admission of guilt? Arrest doesn't imply conviction or even the low bar for indictment. For instance SWAT protocol is to cuff literally everybody else possible on the scene for one and then assess and release after the scene is secured. One would have to be completely stupid and paranoid to think you shouldn't hire someone because they were in a bank robbery turned hostage situation as a victim.
- caseyscottmckay 8y ago
  No that's false. Every single job I've ever applied to has asked about a criminal record. There is, however, a "ban the box" movement in a plurality of states, banning employers from asking potential employees about a criminal record. With the internet documenting all public information, however, it's normally trivial for an employer to do a little research and find the employee's record.
  - Nasrudith 8y ago
    Huh strange that it went straight to banning checking without an innocent until proven guilty standard. I know I have seen plenty of websites for career related where asking if you were convicted had yes, no, or resident of certain states as an effective N/A along with either telling you to select N/A regardless of personal status or flat out forbidding answering if from such a state.
    - ubernostrum 8y ago
      "Ban the box" usually isn't an outright ban on all criminal background checks. The thing it's fighting against is a checkbox/question on the initial job application, to prevent use of it as a universal "not even going to talk to you" filter. Typically, an employer can run a criminal background check in a "ban the box" jurisdiction, but only later in the process (for example: after completing interviews and provisionally deciding this is someone you'd like to hire). There may also be other rules in place about how you can use information from the background check, and what you have to do if you decide to revoke the offer of employment based on the result of the check.
caseyscottmckay 8y ago
Yes, a criminal record never leaves you even if "expunged" or otherwise deleted from your record. First, you have to admit to it with many jobs/other things anyway (e.g., fbi, military, bar exam etc). And it's usually worse to lie about the charge. Second, everything is documented on the internet. Thus, even if you're eventually proven innocent and never had anything to do with the criminal charge, it will still be associated with you throughout life.
- Bjartr 8y ago
  > it will still be associated with you throughout life. This is why I feel we should be pushing towards a culture that accepts that people can make mistakes.

leetcrew 8y ago

not sure what types of jobs would make you answer that question (outside of security maybe), but at least in principle, such questions should be completely illegitimate within the US legal system.

teh_klev 8y ago
In Scotland there's a system called "Disclosure"[0]. There are different types of disclosure[1]: - Basic disclosure - Standard disclosure - Enhanced disclosure - Protecting Vulnerable Groups (PVG) Scheme Depending on the level of disclosure, "spent" convictions may need to be disclosed. You can however apply for spent convictions to be removed from the disclosure process. As an employee for a private consultancy which was carrying out software development work for the Scottish Government I had to get a Basic Disclosure to be able to perform my duties on that contract. It's not that unusual for certain types of work. [0]: https://www.mygov.scot/organisations/disclosure-scotland/ https://www.mygov.scot/organisations/disclosure-scotland/ [1]: https://www.mygov.scot/disclosure-types/ https://www.mygov.scot/disclosure-types/
onetimemanytime 8y ago
US Visa application: "Have you ever been arrested or convicted for any offense or crime, even though subject of a pardon, amnesty, or other similar action?" https://travel.stackexchange.com/questions/78412/what-should-a-uk-citizen-say-when-applying-for-a-us-visa-if-they-were-arrested-a https://travel.stackexchange.com/questions/78412/what-should... It asks but doesn't mean you're automatically denied. BUT a just pardoned person in Seattle would have to answer yes if Canada asked the same question (they probably do)

Nasrudith 8y ago

Isn't asking just if one has been arrested in an interview for nonlaw enforcement positions technically an illegal question without qualifiers to specifically exclude the ones that didn't result in conviction or admission of guilt? Arrest doesn't imply conviction or even the low bar for indictment. For instance SWAT protocol is to cuff literally everybody else possible on the scene for one and then assess and release after the scene is secured. One would have to be completely stupid and paranoid to think you shouldn't hire someone because they were in a bank robbery turned hostage situation as a victim.

caseyscottmckay 8y ago
No that's false. Every single job I've ever applied to has asked about a criminal record. There is, however, a "ban the box" movement in a plurality of states, banning employers from asking potential employees about a criminal record. With the internet documenting all public information, however, it's normally trivial for an employer to do a little research and find the employee's record.
- Nasrudith 8y ago
  Huh strange that it went straight to banning checking without an innocent until proven guilty standard. I know I have seen plenty of websites for career related where asking if you were convicted had yes, no, or resident of certain states as an effective N/A along with either telling you to select N/A regardless of personal status or flat out forbidding answering if from such a state.
  - ubernostrum 8y ago
    "Ban the box" usually isn't an outright ban on all criminal background checks. The thing it's fighting against is a checkbox/question on the initial job application, to prevent use of it as a universal "not even going to talk to you" filter. Typically, an employer can run a criminal background check in a "ban the box" jurisdiction, but only later in the process (for example: after completing interviews and provisionally deciding this is someone you'd like to hire). There may also be other rules in place about how you can use information from the background check, and what you have to do if you decide to revoke the offer of employment based on the result of the check.

caseyscottmckay 8y ago

Yes, a criminal record never leaves you even if "expunged" or otherwise deleted from your record. First, you have to admit to it with many jobs/other things anyway (e.g., fbi, military, bar exam etc). And it's usually worse to lie about the charge. Second, everything is documented on the internet. Thus, even if you're eventually proven innocent and never had anything to do with the criminal charge, it will still be associated with you throughout life.

Bjartr 8y ago
> it will still be associated with you throughout life. This is why I feel we should be pushing towards a culture that accepts that people can make mistakes.