4 ms·

> so there is definitely reason to suspect a link > I didn't "link" anything. Of course there's always a reason to "suspect" a link. But what if this is later

> so there is definitely reason to suspect a link > I didn't "link" anything. Of course there's always a reason to "suspect" a link. But what if this is later dismissed by the (potentially biased) doctors? If they linked the death to something else then the link to the study is strenuous at best. Do you have another reason to "suspect" other than "the doctors must be lying"? Or "it can't be a coincidence"? I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying your suspicions are based on sketchy details from an article. Pizzagate guy also saw a link after a cursory interwebs investigation. He was a smart one... > There is a quote later on coming directly from the doctor, so looks like this study is probably BS Mind giving that quote? And is it the same "I'm suspecting a link but I'm not linking" reasoning applied when you drew the "BS" conclusion? Give a man internet and he'll become an oracle.

nonbel 8y ago
1) There is no way to conclude there is no link from one guy. There are so many possible ways it could be linked. So anyone concluding no link cannot be trusted either due to maliciousness or ignorance. 2) He was apparently stable for 15 years until they started this vagal nerve stimulation, then was dead within months. 3) They don't mention anywhere how they ruled out any of these possible links. 4) They say he died of lung infection and vagus nerve activity is reported to affect lung infection rates: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4127262/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4127262/ 5) Respiratory tract problems are a known side effect of this vagal nerve stimulation technique: https://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-procedures/vagus-nerve-stimulation/about/pac-20384565 https://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-procedures/vagus-nerve-stim... Even only #1 is enough for me to not trust them. Note that my conclusion is not about any "link", my conclusion is that these are people who draw unwarranted conclusions for whatever reason. >"Pizzagate guy also saw a link after a cursory interwebs investigation. He was a smart one..." There seems to be a problem in this thread of people (not just you) confusing lack of evidence with disproving a link, or even proving a link. I am saying there is just "lack of evidence" as to what happened. Maybe it was fully or partially due to the procedure, maybe not. > "Mind giving that quote?" It was in the same article under discussion: 'Of the decision not to report the death, Sirigu told the Guardian: “The patient’s death was not linked to our protocol. He entered in our study in January 2016 and his participation ended [at the] beginning of September 2016. We respected the family decision to not communicate about the event. What was important for us was to keep the event in the privacy of this wonderful family.”'
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nonbel 8y ago

1) There is no way to conclude there is no link from one guy. There are so many possible ways it could be linked. So anyone concluding no link cannot be trusted either due to maliciousness or ignorance. 2) He was apparently stable for 15 years until they started this vagal nerve stimulation, then was dead within months. 3) They don't mention anywhere how they ruled out any of these possible links. 4) They say he died of lung infection and vagus nerve activity is reported to affect lung infection rates: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4127262/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4127262/ 5) Respiratory tract problems are a known side effect of this vagal nerve stimulation technique: https://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-procedures/vagus-nerve-stimulation/about/pac-20384565 https://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-procedures/vagus-nerve-stim... Even only #1 is enough for me to not trust them. Note that my conclusion is not about any "link", my conclusion is that these are people who draw unwarranted conclusions for whatever reason. >"Pizzagate guy also saw a link after a cursory interwebs investigation. He was a smart one..." There seems to be a problem in this thread of people (not just you) confusing lack of evidence with disproving a link, or even proving a link. I am saying there is just "lack of evidence" as to what happened. Maybe it was fully or partially due to the procedure, maybe not. > "Mind giving that quote?" It was in the same article under discussion: 'Of the decision not to report the death, Sirigu told the Guardian: “The patient’s death was not linked to our protocol. He entered in our study in January 2016 and his participation ended [at the] beginning of September 2016. We respected the family decision to not communicate about the event. What was important for us was to keep the event in the privacy of this wonderful family.”'

deleted 8y ago
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