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> I have to say it's such a giant bloated thing that it really does not make me want to write native code. Why? You can write (and compile, and test) native c

> I have to say it's such a giant bloated thing that it really does not make me want to write native code. Why? You can write (and compile, and test) native code without ever touching Android Studio. I would think any like/hate of IntelliJ (Android Studio) should have no bearing on whether you choose to write native Android code or not. It would be like saying, "CLion is such a giant bloated thing that I never want to write C++ code". Or "RubyMine is so giant and bloated, I never want to touch Ruby on Rails again". What would you say, for example, if someone told you they didn't want to write a Progressive Web App because they really disliked Atom and Visual Studio Code?

Scarbutt 8y ago
If you are into masochism, sure, use Java without an IDE ;)
- topspin 8y ago
  Hmm. I don't find that terribly masochistic. If you know the language, the basic java.* classes and your usual third parties libraries (guava, commons, etc.) well enough you can get a long way without and IDE. I've done a great deal of work -- typically maintenance and troubleshooting -- just cloning a repo and working in vim. I avoid any degree of dependence on IDEs for any part of building, packaging, etc. so... why bother with an IDE unless you really need IDE features?
  - balladeer 8y ago
    > unless you really need IDE features and that's very often if you are a Java/Android dev. Even features like auto complete (let alone with prediction) is very hard to get right elsewhere, let's say, somewhere like Vim. Not just the language, there's Android SDK itself and other libraries. But, if you count "not needing auto complete etc" as part of "know the language well enough" or that they trivial enough then, well, I rest my case.
    - topspin 8y ago
      > very hard to get right elsewhere I wrote substantial systems before there were any Java IDEs. Nothing hard about it. Write a lot of code and it's easy. If that disturbs you I'm sorry, but you should allow that there are people with more skill than perhaps you've been exposed to.
      - balladeer 8y ago
        No, it doesn't disturb me at all. At work and among friends there are people who have more skills than I am exposed to and I get to learn a lot from them. However none of them ever advocate not using an IDE or claim not needing an IDE. In fact a lot of them use one or the other. I used to write in Vim (C) when I worked for that South Korean giant. After that I moved to Java/Android and I wouldn't get back to those days of Vim/C for anything. So I think it comes down to choice. The thing is GP commenter mentioned "masochism" and now I see the point.

Scarbutt 8y ago

If you are into masochism, sure, use Java without an IDE ;)

topspin 8y ago
Hmm. I don't find that terribly masochistic. If you know the language, the basic java.* classes and your usual third parties libraries (guava, commons, etc.) well enough you can get a long way without and IDE. I've done a great deal of work -- typically maintenance and troubleshooting -- just cloning a repo and working in vim. I avoid any degree of dependence on IDEs for any part of building, packaging, etc. so... why bother with an IDE unless you really need IDE features?
- balladeer 8y ago
  > unless you really need IDE features and that's very often if you are a Java/Android dev. Even features like auto complete (let alone with prediction) is very hard to get right elsewhere, let's say, somewhere like Vim. Not just the language, there's Android SDK itself and other libraries. But, if you count "not needing auto complete etc" as part of "know the language well enough" or that they trivial enough then, well, I rest my case.
  - topspin 8y ago
    > very hard to get right elsewhere I wrote substantial systems before there were any Java IDEs. Nothing hard about it. Write a lot of code and it's easy. If that disturbs you I'm sorry, but you should allow that there are people with more skill than perhaps you've been exposed to.
    - balladeer 8y ago
      No, it doesn't disturb me at all. At work and among friends there are people who have more skills than I am exposed to and I get to learn a lot from them. However none of them ever advocate not using an IDE or claim not needing an IDE. In fact a lot of them use one or the other. I used to write in Vim (C) when I worked for that South Korean giant. After that I moved to Java/Android and I wouldn't get back to those days of Vim/C for anything. So I think it comes down to choice. The thing is GP commenter mentioned "masochism" and now I see the point.