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> Otherwise citizens can use satellite phones. And how many actually will?

bilbo0s 8y ago
I think sometimes that tech guys say these things that are completely unrealistic because they themselves find the thing to be completely reasonable and acceptable. I feel like we don't really have a good understanding of how normal, non-tech centric, people work. I mean really, satellite phones? Unless we're planning on moving our entire terrestrial mobile data infrastructure to be satellite based, that's just not practical. To even suggest it is just the height of naiveté. If someone can already provide her family access to LCD Chinese culture, what benefit is there in her going that extra mile to get access to LCD Western culture? (Ignoring the fact that she's probably not even aware there is a difference between a cell phone and a satellite phone in terms of data access. And please, answer that question from the perspective of the average Chinese female secretary just trying to get her kid fed and put to bed every night. And try to answer honestly.)
tlb 8y ago
Not many, but it doesn’t take many to have an impact. A historical parallel is the use of shortwave receivers inside the USSR to receive Radio Free Europe. It was illegal to listen to, and the KGB jammed it sometimes, but people listened secretly anyway and it was an important conduit of information into an otherwise mostly closed society.
- golergka 8y ago
  > it was an important conduit of information into an otherwise mostly closed society No it wasn't, really. Have you actually experienced this or are you retelling some long-read from New Yorker? Sorry if it reads as uncalled for personal attack, just that I and my family have much more first-hand experience with this, and while having western news was nice, it really didn't affect the political stability of the regime in any meaningful way. People are not rational. They don't make decisions based on information presented to them. They mostly just repeat whatever opinion they perceive to be popular, usually without even asking themselves if they believe it or not. Propaganda is not about making people think something. Propaganda is about making people think that most of other people think so.
  - tlb 8y ago
    My wife's family were dissidents in Czechoslovakia, and they've mentioned western shortwave broadcasts as being part of their political climate between 1968 and 1989. But that's a small sample size. For sure, a shortwave broadcast isn't going to change the majority opinion the way 24/7 propaganda can. But it can influence a few intellectuals, who in turn influence others. It's impossible to do a randomized controlled trial to measure its effectiveness.

I think sometimes that tech guys say these things that are completely unrealistic because they themselves find the thing to be completely reasonable and acceptable. I feel like we don't really have a good understanding of how normal, non-tech centric, people work. I mean really, satellite phones? Unless we're planning on moving our entire terrestrial mobile data infrastructure to be satellite based, that's just not practical. To even suggest it is just the height of naiveté. If someone can already provide her family access to LCD Chinese culture, what benefit is there in her going that extra mile to get access to LCD Western culture? (Ignoring the fact that she's probably not even aware there is a difference between a cell phone and a satellite phone in terms of data access. And please, answer that question from the perspective of the average Chinese female secretary just trying to get her kid fed and put to bed every night. And try to answer honestly.)

tlb 8y ago

Not many, but it doesn’t take many to have an impact. A historical parallel is the use of shortwave receivers inside the USSR to receive Radio Free Europe. It was illegal to listen to, and the KGB jammed it sometimes, but people listened secretly anyway and it was an important conduit of information into an otherwise mostly closed society.

golergka 8y ago
> it was an important conduit of information into an otherwise mostly closed society No it wasn't, really. Have you actually experienced this or are you retelling some long-read from New Yorker? Sorry if it reads as uncalled for personal attack, just that I and my family have much more first-hand experience with this, and while having western news was nice, it really didn't affect the political stability of the regime in any meaningful way. People are not rational. They don't make decisions based on information presented to them. They mostly just repeat whatever opinion they perceive to be popular, usually without even asking themselves if they believe it or not. Propaganda is not about making people think something. Propaganda is about making people think that most of other people think so.
- tlb 8y ago
  My wife's family were dissidents in Czechoslovakia, and they've mentioned western shortwave broadcasts as being part of their political climate between 1968 and 1989. But that's a small sample size. For sure, a shortwave broadcast isn't going to change the majority opinion the way 24/7 propaganda can. But it can influence a few intellectuals, who in turn influence others. It's impossible to do a randomized controlled trial to measure its effectiveness.