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I tried to treat you like a not-dictator and to express my concerns in a reasonable manner. You reacted as a dictator. Banning my accounts does nothing but dri

by shawn 8y ago

I tried to treat you like a not-dictator and to express my concerns in a reasonable manner. You reacted as a dictator. Banning my accounts does nothing but drive me underground for three months. You don't know all of my accounts, unless you propose to ban all Tor users. Your explanation is always the same: "Your comments are misleading." But they don't seem misleading from my point of view. I seem to be throwing all of my effort into them, and being banned and shunned in response.

dang 8y ago
That's not the explanation; the explanation is what I said above: off-topicness, drama, metaness, troll topics, self-referential rants, and tedious back-and-forths. What I described is really a 3-month probation rather than a ban, during which your comments will default to [dead] but we'll be happy to vouch for the good ones. Since our software doesn't do probations, we have to use the ban system to do this. When you use Hacker News as intended—i.e. when you post out of intellectual curiosity—your contributions range from fine to wonderful. But you're doing way more than this. You post many things that come from a very different place than intellectual curiosity. Those posts have a lot of energy, but they're not interesting in HN's sense of interesting. When you do this, you lower the signal/noise ratio here, often very badly. Other users get sucked in for their own reasons, resulting in large, tedious subthreads that nobody else cares about. That's not what this site is for. Lowering the signal/noise ratio is the reason why we moderate anyone here. It isn't personal. Personally, we admire your cleverness and like you, which is why Scott and I have spent so many hours communicating with you, trying to help you, trying to get you to fix this. Most anyone else would have been banned a long time ago. I'm sure it's true that we don't know all your accounts. And I'm sure you can create all sorts more trouble for us if you want. But for what reason? Doing that is not going to feel any better.
- shawn 8y ago
  What I described is really a 3-month probation rather than a ban, during which your comments will default to [dead] but we'll be happy to vouch for the good ones. Since our software doesn't do probations, we have to use the ban system to do this. You say my words are misleading... This deserves a thorough rebuttal, but it's late. In the meantime: Actually, this is a ban. You have this habit of reframing words to mean the exact opposite of commonly-accepted terms. Hell, the definition of "probation" is "the release of an offender from detention, subject to a period of good behavior under supervision." Note the word "release," not "imprison." That's not the explanation; the explanation is what I said above: off-topicness, drama, metaness, troll topics, self-referential rants, and tedious back-and-forths. That's not an explanation, Dan. Those are labels that you use to sweep under the rug what you wish you didn't have to deal with. It's very easy to explain to someone what they did wrong: Quote them, and say "This is not okay, because <specific reason, not a label>. Would you please stop doing this?" Obviously, you could pull quotes from my recent comment history. But my recent comment history was to catch your attention and demand that you give some minimum form of explanation, like "You are rate limited for two months. Check back then." Even the most trollish of trolls get this courtesy, but I do not. And when I ask for it, I'm ignored. When I demand it, I'm banned until the new year. This is the tedious back and forth. Can't we see eye to eye? You want me to act a certain way, and I have given you every indication that I will act that way if only I could understand what you want. You use labels like "off-topicness, drama, and troll topics," when from my point of view most other users are talking about these same topics and engaging in some spirited and interesting conversation. And I'm sure you can create all sorts more trouble for us if you want. But for what reason? Doing that is not going to feel any better. I don't want to cause you trouble. But I also didn't pick this fight.

by shawn 8y ago

dang 8y ago

That's not the explanation; the explanation is what I said above: off-topicness, drama, metaness, troll topics, self-referential rants, and tedious back-and-forths. What I described is really a 3-month probation rather than a ban, during which your comments will default to [dead] but we'll be happy to vouch for the good ones. Since our software doesn't do probations, we have to use the ban system to do this. When you use Hacker News as intended—i.e. when you post out of intellectual curiosity—your contributions range from fine to wonderful. But you're doing way more than this. You post many things that come from a very different place than intellectual curiosity. Those posts have a lot of energy, but they're not interesting in HN's sense of interesting. When you do this, you lower the signal/noise ratio here, often very badly. Other users get sucked in for their own reasons, resulting in large, tedious subthreads that nobody else cares about. That's not what this site is for. Lowering the signal/noise ratio is the reason why we moderate anyone here. It isn't personal. Personally, we admire your cleverness and like you, which is why Scott and I have spent so many hours communicating with you, trying to help you, trying to get you to fix this. Most anyone else would have been banned a long time ago. I'm sure it's true that we don't know all your accounts. And I'm sure you can create all sorts more trouble for us if you want. But for what reason? Doing that is not going to feel any better.

shawn 8y ago
What I described is really a 3-month probation rather than a ban, during which your comments will default to [dead] but we'll be happy to vouch for the good ones. Since our software doesn't do probations, we have to use the ban system to do this. You say my words are misleading... This deserves a thorough rebuttal, but it's late. In the meantime: Actually, this is a ban. You have this habit of reframing words to mean the exact opposite of commonly-accepted terms. Hell, the definition of "probation" is "the release of an offender from detention, subject to a period of good behavior under supervision." Note the word "release," not "imprison." That's not the explanation; the explanation is what I said above: off-topicness, drama, metaness, troll topics, self-referential rants, and tedious back-and-forths. That's not an explanation, Dan. Those are labels that you use to sweep under the rug what you wish you didn't have to deal with. It's very easy to explain to someone what they did wrong: Quote them, and say "This is not okay, because <specific reason, not a label>. Would you please stop doing this?" Obviously, you could pull quotes from my recent comment history. But my recent comment history was to catch your attention and demand that you give some minimum form of explanation, like "You are rate limited for two months. Check back then." Even the most trollish of trolls get this courtesy, but I do not. And when I ask for it, I'm ignored. When I demand it, I'm banned until the new year. This is the tedious back and forth. Can't we see eye to eye? You want me to act a certain way, and I have given you every indication that I will act that way if only I could understand what you want. You use labels like "off-topicness, drama, and troll topics," when from my point of view most other users are talking about these same topics and engaging in some spirited and interesting conversation. And I'm sure you can create all sorts more trouble for us if you want. But for what reason? Doing that is not going to feel any better. I don't want to cause you trouble. But I also didn't pick this fight.