5 ms·

I'm a non-24 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-24-hour_sleep%E2%80%93wake_disorder https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-24-hour_sleep%E2%80%93wake...). I consiste

I'm a non-24 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-24-hour_sleep%E2%80%93wake_disorder https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-24-hour_sleep%E2%80%93wake...). I consistently drift forwards 1-2 hours / day. Nobody believes me when I tell them. I started seriously tracking my sleep a few months back, and two months ago I started to use "Sleep as Android", which has a neat feature that shows you a graph of the times you are asleep. This is mine for the past 2 months: https://i.imgur.com/PHohyO6.png https://i.imgur.com/PHohyO6.png I was myself shocked by how consistent the drift is. Anyway all that to say, I often experienced pretty much what that excerpt describes. Very frustrating.

devxpy 8y ago
The book even has a number on this! > The second unexpected—and more profound—result was that their reliably repeating cycles of wake and sleep were not precisely twenty-four hours in length, but consistently and undeniably longer than twenty-four hours. Richardson, in his twenties, developed a sleep-wake cycle of between twenty-six and twenty-eight hours in length. That of Kleitman, in his forties, was a little closer to, but still longer than, twenty-four hours. Therefore, when removed from the external influence of daylight, the internally generated “day” of each man was not exactly twenty-four hours, but a little more than that. Like an inaccurate wristwatch whose time runs long, with each passing (real) day in the outside world, Kleitman and Richardson began to add time based on their longer, internally generated chronometry.
lamontcg 8y ago
Yeah I used to do that in college. Wish society would be more accepting of that. I'd likely be way more productive if I could just do that, and wouldn't have the sleep dep days that I do when I just power through it on zombie mode for a day or three until I can get back on the 24 hour schedule. I find 5 mg of melatonin taken an hour before I got to bed combined with learning to use a sleep mask helped a lot. I still need to go to bed listening to something (that isn't too interesting to me) in order to derail my thoughts as well. Plus not eating late, and something in junk food (MSG/salt?) tends to keep me up all night almost in hot sweats. But with all that it has just become manageable so that I can hold down a job.
- Teckla 8y ago
  I read somewhere (lost the source) that 5 mg is far too much, and that closer to 0.5 mg is not only sufficient, but works better. Do you have any experience changing the size of your melatonin dose, and if so, could you share any findings?
  - a1369209993 8y ago
    http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/ http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-tha... Mostly under "2. What is the right dose of melatonin?", but you should probably read the whole thing.
    - Teckla 8y ago
      Thank you! That was extremely informative.
sleepy1 8y ago
I have similarly experienced non 24 on a roughly 26 hr cycle. I'm curious if you've had your vitamin D levels checked? Mine were abysmal, <13 ng/mL. I've been working on improving that with both a supplement and regular sun exposure. I'm not "fixed", but staying up feels much more like a conscious decision and less like it's out of my control.
- scrollaway 8y ago
  I haven't. I'll check this out, thank you :)
dest 8y ago
Relevant xkcd https://xkcd.com/320/ https://xkcd.com/320/
monort 8y ago
I used to sleep like this for many years, though I shifted a little less than one hour per day, my full circle was around a month. What fixed it for me: 1) Getting out every day, even when I don't have to. 2) Using alarm for going to sleep, not for waking up. 3) I think this is the main one - I've got some social obligations, so I needed to be awake during the day.
mcovey 8y ago
I also think I'm non-24. Unfortunately its only considered a real disorder in the blind. Taking melatonin helps a bit -- I'm convinced my pineal gland is broken somehow.

devxpy 8y ago

The book even has a number on this! > The second unexpected—and more profound—result was that their reliably repeating cycles of wake and sleep were not precisely twenty-four hours in length, but consistently and undeniably longer than twenty-four hours. Richardson, in his twenties, developed a sleep-wake cycle of between twenty-six and twenty-eight hours in length. That of Kleitman, in his forties, was a little closer to, but still longer than, twenty-four hours. Therefore, when removed from the external influence of daylight, the internally generated “day” of each man was not exactly twenty-four hours, but a little more than that. Like an inaccurate wristwatch whose time runs long, with each passing (real) day in the outside world, Kleitman and Richardson began to add time based on their longer, internally generated chronometry.

lamontcg 8y ago

Yeah I used to do that in college. Wish society would be more accepting of that. I'd likely be way more productive if I could just do that, and wouldn't have the sleep dep days that I do when I just power through it on zombie mode for a day or three until I can get back on the 24 hour schedule. I find 5 mg of melatonin taken an hour before I got to bed combined with learning to use a sleep mask helped a lot. I still need to go to bed listening to something (that isn't too interesting to me) in order to derail my thoughts as well. Plus not eating late, and something in junk food (MSG/salt?) tends to keep me up all night almost in hot sweats. But with all that it has just become manageable so that I can hold down a job.

Teckla 8y ago
I read somewhere (lost the source) that 5 mg is far too much, and that closer to 0.5 mg is not only sufficient, but works better. Do you have any experience changing the size of your melatonin dose, and if so, could you share any findings?
- a1369209993 8y ago
  http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/ http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-tha... Mostly under "2. What is the right dose of melatonin?", but you should probably read the whole thing.
  - Teckla 8y ago
    Thank you! That was extremely informative.

sleepy1 8y ago

I have similarly experienced non 24 on a roughly 26 hr cycle. I'm curious if you've had your vitamin D levels checked? Mine were abysmal, <13 ng/mL. I've been working on improving that with both a supplement and regular sun exposure. I'm not "fixed", but staying up feels much more like a conscious decision and less like it's out of my control.

scrollaway 8y ago
I haven't. I'll check this out, thank you :)

dest 8y ago

Relevant xkcd https://xkcd.com/320/ https://xkcd.com/320/

monort 8y ago

I used to sleep like this for many years, though I shifted a little less than one hour per day, my full circle was around a month. What fixed it for me: 1) Getting out every day, even when I don't have to. 2) Using alarm for going to sleep, not for waking up. 3) I think this is the main one - I've got some social obligations, so I needed to be awake during the day.

mcovey 8y ago

I also think I'm non-24. Unfortunately its only considered a real disorder in the blind. Taking melatonin helps a bit -- I'm convinced my pineal gland is broken somehow.