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Studying at University in Australia as an international student is not about the education, its about the immigration pathway it enables. Australia has somethin

Studying at University in Australia as an international student is not about the education, its about the immigration pathway it enables. Australia has something like 600,000 international students, second only to the USA, because all international students are immediately given a work visa, and then can permanently migrate to the country fairly easily at the end of the degree. Once you have PR you can access welfare and medicare, and can bring your whole family over eventually.

wodenokoto 8y ago
Is this being downvoted because it is factually inaccurate? I think it's an interesting point.
danieltillett 8y ago
Yep the whole thing is a total scam. My local Coles (Australian supermarket) is 100% staffed by overseas people who did a degree (mostly accounting from my informal questioning) here in Australia and who got PR via this degree.
- wp381640 8y ago
  It isn't a scam if it is working exactly as intended It's a backdoor way into Australia that not many Australians know about and nobody rocks the boat on because everybody knows the country needs the migrants and investment. Ditto with the investment visas. Pretty crazy when at the same time everybody loses their minds over boats with a few hundred people on them
  - danieltillett 8y ago
    Australia does not need more migrants. Our entire economy is a Ponzi scheme based around immigration driving ever higher house prices. The more the major parties ignore this issue the more power it gives to those on the political extremes. The issue with the boats is it would not be a few hundred people for very long as the Europeans have found out over the last few years.
    - woah 8y ago
      Maybe you need to build more houses? This kind of denial of reality and xenophobia is rampant in SF as well.
      - danieltillett 8y ago
        We re building masses of houses. The problem is not the building of houses, but the not building of all the infrustructure required to support all the new residents - roads, schools, hospitals, public transport, sewerage, electricity, water, etc. It is not xenophobia to want to see responsible development where development only occurs when it is supported by the infrustucture. If we can't afford to build the infrustucture then don't create the housing.
  - beerlord 8y ago
    Immigration levels are at all-time highs into Australia right now. The #1 source country is India, #2 China. Australia hit 25 million people 33 years earlier than planned, and annual migration levels are about 300,000. Immigration is achieving the following: - Lowers wages by increasing supply of labour, including creating a pool of workers willing to be employed at illegal rates - $10/hour. Many workers are willing to work for these rates, substantially below minimum wages, because it is more than they would earn in their home country, and because of promises from the employer that they will sponsor them for permanent residency. (Typically they will be paid correct minimum wage for 20 hours work, but in reality be staffed to work 30 to 50 hours). - Increasing demand on public services. More people means a greater need for shared services: health, education, public transport, roads, welfare. Considering that the majority (~80%) of new migrants are going to Melbourne and Sydney, two built-up mature megacities of 5 million people, adding more services to these cities is incredibly expensive (eg. a new rail line means tunnelling, land buy-back, extensive shutdowns of existing road and rail etc). - Increases consumption. This means increased consumer demand throughout the economy, simply based on the higher number of people. However, it also means consumption in an environmental sense: increased demand for water (which we need to desalinate, on the margins), increased demand for food and land (resulting in land clearance), increased CO2 emissions (Australia is a CO2 intensive country), increased pollution and waste. - Increased demand for land and housing. Young Australians can no longer buy a house in their own country, and home ownership is at historical lows. Huge amounts of houses are being converted to large apartments. So, if you're a land-owner and business-owner, happy days. You have greater demand for the things you own, and lower wages to pay out. If you're a tradesperson, you're also benefiting a lot from the intense housing and infrastructure construction activity. If you're an average Australian, you have lower wages, higher congestion on public services, increased taxes to pay for those services to be expanded, and no hope (in many cases) of buying your own house. There is also the added social friction of these two large groups of migrants moving to the country - Indian and mainland Chinese culture is dissimilar to Australian. Already we are seeing neighbourhoods stratified by ethnicity.
  - spangry 8y ago
    Why was beerlord's comment (same depth as this comment) flagged and killed? It was a perfectly reasonable (and informative) comment. Was it not sufficiently pro immigration?
    - danieltillett 8y ago
      Beerlord's comment was skating very close to outright racism. I don't think he did cross the line, but I can see how people might think he did.
- tphan 8y ago
  I didn't realise that there might've been a pattern! A lot of the Uber drivers I talk to in Australia also claim to do accounting on the side.
sumedh 8y ago
> and can bring your whole family over eventually. You have to pay 100K AUD for bringing your parents.

wodenokoto 8y ago

Is this being downvoted because it is factually inaccurate? I think it's an interesting point.

danieltillett 8y ago

Yep the whole thing is a total scam. My local Coles (Australian supermarket) is 100% staffed by overseas people who did a degree (mostly accounting from my informal questioning) here in Australia and who got PR via this degree.

wp381640 8y ago
It isn't a scam if it is working exactly as intended It's a backdoor way into Australia that not many Australians know about and nobody rocks the boat on because everybody knows the country needs the migrants and investment. Ditto with the investment visas. Pretty crazy when at the same time everybody loses their minds over boats with a few hundred people on them
- danieltillett 8y ago
  Australia does not need more migrants. Our entire economy is a Ponzi scheme based around immigration driving ever higher house prices. The more the major parties ignore this issue the more power it gives to those on the political extremes. The issue with the boats is it would not be a few hundred people for very long as the Europeans have found out over the last few years.
  - woah 8y ago
    Maybe you need to build more houses? This kind of denial of reality and xenophobia is rampant in SF as well.
    - danieltillett 8y ago
      We re building masses of houses. The problem is not the building of houses, but the not building of all the infrustructure required to support all the new residents - roads, schools, hospitals, public transport, sewerage, electricity, water, etc. It is not xenophobia to want to see responsible development where development only occurs when it is supported by the infrustucture. If we can't afford to build the infrustucture then don't create the housing.
- beerlord 8y ago
  Immigration levels are at all-time highs into Australia right now. The #1 source country is India, #2 China. Australia hit 25 million people 33 years earlier than planned, and annual migration levels are about 300,000. Immigration is achieving the following: - Lowers wages by increasing supply of labour, including creating a pool of workers willing to be employed at illegal rates - $10/hour. Many workers are willing to work for these rates, substantially below minimum wages, because it is more than they would earn in their home country, and because of promises from the employer that they will sponsor them for permanent residency. (Typically they will be paid correct minimum wage for 20 hours work, but in reality be staffed to work 30 to 50 hours). - Increasing demand on public services. More people means a greater need for shared services: health, education, public transport, roads, welfare. Considering that the majority (~80%) of new migrants are going to Melbourne and Sydney, two built-up mature megacities of 5 million people, adding more services to these cities is incredibly expensive (eg. a new rail line means tunnelling, land buy-back, extensive shutdowns of existing road and rail etc). - Increases consumption. This means increased consumer demand throughout the economy, simply based on the higher number of people. However, it also means consumption in an environmental sense: increased demand for water (which we need to desalinate, on the margins), increased demand for food and land (resulting in land clearance), increased CO2 emissions (Australia is a CO2 intensive country), increased pollution and waste. - Increased demand for land and housing. Young Australians can no longer buy a house in their own country, and home ownership is at historical lows. Huge amounts of houses are being converted to large apartments. So, if you're a land-owner and business-owner, happy days. You have greater demand for the things you own, and lower wages to pay out. If you're a tradesperson, you're also benefiting a lot from the intense housing and infrastructure construction activity. If you're an average Australian, you have lower wages, higher congestion on public services, increased taxes to pay for those services to be expanded, and no hope (in many cases) of buying your own house. There is also the added social friction of these two large groups of migrants moving to the country - Indian and mainland Chinese culture is dissimilar to Australian. Already we are seeing neighbourhoods stratified by ethnicity.
- spangry 8y ago
  Why was beerlord's comment (same depth as this comment) flagged and killed? It was a perfectly reasonable (and informative) comment. Was it not sufficiently pro immigration?
  - danieltillett 8y ago
    Beerlord's comment was skating very close to outright racism. I don't think he did cross the line, but I can see how people might think he did.
tphan 8y ago
I didn't realise that there might've been a pattern! A lot of the Uber drivers I talk to in Australia also claim to do accounting on the side.

sumedh 8y ago

> and can bring your whole family over eventually. You have to pay 100K AUD for bringing your parents.