5 ms·

What does diversity of thought even mean?

by rfw 8y ago

fchollet 8y ago
It's an expression I've heard sometimes in America. From the context in which I've seen it used, I believe it means roughly "I don't like brown/black people, but lately it has become difficult to say it out loud and I'm angry about that" People are typically not concerned about "diversity of thought" when it comes to fiscal policy or foreign policy. They're concerned about the things that they'll get in trouble for saying. You know what that is.
- coupdetaco 8y ago
  US Progressives made a secular church and are tone policing everyone who steps out of the new orthodoxy. It's a very well documented issue in the states, since the Closing of the American Mind and the Diversity Myth in 80s, then Unqualified Reservations in the 2000s, then Donald Trump getting elected.
- lebanon_tn 8y ago
  This is an astonishingly bad faith argument.
  - cromwellian 8y ago
    I haven’t seen any conservative raked over the coals for arguments about libertarian economics or foreig policy. Almost invariably, they face backlash for opinions on gay marriage, trans issues, immigrants, and race or gender discrimination. Do you think criticism of Damore would have been as fervent if he circulated a memo calling for deregulation and tax cuts? Don’t muddle the waters by mixing up opposition to conservative economic or foreign policy with opposition to racial and gender equality and tolerance of LGBTQ. Identity politics sets people afire far more than abstract economics for precisely the reason that it is personal and often something that’s a fact of your birth or upbringing which is not a choice.
    - jakeogh 8y ago
      Or, if one has no good reply to real arguments, it's possible to reach for unrelated emotional ones.
    - coupdetaco 8y ago
      1. homosexuals - unclear that sexual identity should trump religious identity on the grounds that people choose their religious identity. Maybe don't pick that fight? 2. trans - new social category used to add up to 51% over normal people. Undermining people trying to be good men and good women by focusing on their own genetalia/body and eliminating categories in society so that we can have a more culturally relativistic postmodern utopia that is experienced by christians as satanic since in practice its diametrically opposed to christians themselves to assert thousands of ways of knowing as more important that a prescribed way of life concerning mom and dad raising children. At best, its a distraction and it makes American style democracy even more about protecting 'victimized minorities' from 'oppressive majorities' and thereby undermining democracy itself. These bombastic social issues and papering over them with collectively reciting individual rights against a democratic way of life are the reason why liberals are seen as feckless in the face of conflict between groups that cannot be made to get along. Trans people are people. Let's leave it at that. 3. Immigrants - this is clearly mostly an economic issue, and tolerance requires borders. Replacement migration is substitute for making new americans ourselves. It would be an improvement for leftist goals if the government cared about the difficulty of having children today. An accountability system from the economy to its own people, much less a majority, is missing when we conceive of an economy that is not in service to its people. Race or gender discrimination - equality under the law. Leftists want to elevate minorities in the form of rainbow coalition/intersectionality/coalition of the fringes. Lady justice is supposed to be blind, yet the 'liberal' media love to attack white men and sell advertising agianst it for racists. White male republicans are wrongfully discriminated against by the mainstream culture, which is not the same thing as the society. A lot of the culture just hates middle america the same as the middle east (amy chua) and this tribalism is discriminating against people in such a way as to be cross cutting effect some non-whites, some females, and some non-republicans. You can't turn on ESPN to escape from it. It's totalitarian and therefore is not respectable. Meanwhile, leftists want to be rewarded based on victim status and ensure equality of outcome (facebook pays everyone with the same title the same, and brings on women and minorities that are unqualified and including 'white people', barely literate and ask me to help them write emails in english. Ask any recruiter for them and they can confirm this for you. Identity is the bedrock of all politics, which is obvious. Your inability to see that is only your own ethnocentrism.
  - tptacek 8y ago
    Is it? It's approximately what I believe about the expression too. Can you explain why it must be bad faith?
- lgleason 8y ago
  Black conservatives such as Candice Owens also talk about this. Basically one side will label any idea they don't like as racist and call black conservatives white nationalists etc.. The other is saying that there should be diversity of opinions including ones that may be uncomfortable and even racist because ultimately they believe the bad ones, such as racism will get weeded out. The other issue is that the race card has become so abused in the US that it has lost meaning. When black conservatives are labelled white nationalists 1+1 is not equaling 2.
  - tptacek 8y ago
    Candice Owens is a crackpot. If she's the best rhetorical card you have to play, you don't have much of an argument. She's a failed Youtuber making a second go of it as a political commenter, by way (literally) of Infowars. There are serious black conservatives. Tim Scott, for instance. Michael Steele. Crystal Wright, maybe. Find one of them being called a "white nationalist", rather than trying to read tea leaves out of the reactions to an Internet troll.
    - coupdetaco 8y ago
      Jesse Lee Peterson is also a top black republican influencer among actual american blacks

What does diversity of thought even mean?

by rfw 8y ago

What does diversity of thought even mean?

It's an expression I've heard sometimes in America. From the context in which I've seen it used, I believe it means roughly "I don't like brown/black people, but lately it has become difficult to say it out loud and I'm angry about that" People are typically not concerned about "diversity of thought" when it comes to fiscal policy or foreign policy. They're concerned about the things that they'll get in trouble for saying. You know what that is.

coupdetaco 8y ago
US Progressives made a secular church and are tone policing everyone who steps out of the new orthodoxy. It's a very well documented issue in the states, since the Closing of the American Mind and the Diversity Myth in 80s, then Unqualified Reservations in the 2000s, then Donald Trump getting elected.
lebanon_tn 8y ago
This is an astonishingly bad faith argument.
- cromwellian 8y ago
  I haven’t seen any conservative raked over the coals for arguments about libertarian economics or foreig policy. Almost invariably, they face backlash for opinions on gay marriage, trans issues, immigrants, and race or gender discrimination. Do you think criticism of Damore would have been as fervent if he circulated a memo calling for deregulation and tax cuts? Don’t muddle the waters by mixing up opposition to conservative economic or foreign policy with opposition to racial and gender equality and tolerance of LGBTQ. Identity politics sets people afire far more than abstract economics for precisely the reason that it is personal and often something that’s a fact of your birth or upbringing which is not a choice.
  - jakeogh 8y ago
    Or, if one has no good reply to real arguments, it's possible to reach for unrelated emotional ones.
  - coupdetaco 8y ago
    1. homosexuals - unclear that sexual identity should trump religious identity on the grounds that people choose their religious identity. Maybe don't pick that fight? 2. trans - new social category used to add up to 51% over normal people. Undermining people trying to be good men and good women by focusing on their own genetalia/body and eliminating categories in society so that we can have a more culturally relativistic postmodern utopia that is experienced by christians as satanic since in practice its diametrically opposed to christians themselves to assert thousands of ways of knowing as more important that a prescribed way of life concerning mom and dad raising children. At best, its a distraction and it makes American style democracy even more about protecting 'victimized minorities' from 'oppressive majorities' and thereby undermining democracy itself. These bombastic social issues and papering over them with collectively reciting individual rights against a democratic way of life are the reason why liberals are seen as feckless in the face of conflict between groups that cannot be made to get along. Trans people are people. Let's leave it at that. 3. Immigrants - this is clearly mostly an economic issue, and tolerance requires borders. Replacement migration is substitute for making new americans ourselves. It would be an improvement for leftist goals if the government cared about the difficulty of having children today. An accountability system from the economy to its own people, much less a majority, is missing when we conceive of an economy that is not in service to its people. Race or gender discrimination - equality under the law. Leftists want to elevate minorities in the form of rainbow coalition/intersectionality/coalition of the fringes. Lady justice is supposed to be blind, yet the 'liberal' media love to attack white men and sell advertising agianst it for racists. White male republicans are wrongfully discriminated against by the mainstream culture, which is not the same thing as the society. A lot of the culture just hates middle america the same as the middle east (amy chua) and this tribalism is discriminating against people in such a way as to be cross cutting effect some non-whites, some females, and some non-republicans. You can't turn on ESPN to escape from it. It's totalitarian and therefore is not respectable. Meanwhile, leftists want to be rewarded based on victim status and ensure equality of outcome (facebook pays everyone with the same title the same, and brings on women and minorities that are unqualified and including 'white people', barely literate and ask me to help them write emails in english. Ask any recruiter for them and they can confirm this for you. Identity is the bedrock of all politics, which is obvious. Your inability to see that is only your own ethnocentrism.
- tptacek 8y ago
  Is it? It's approximately what I believe about the expression too. Can you explain why it must be bad faith?
lgleason 8y ago
Black conservatives such as Candice Owens also talk about this. Basically one side will label any idea they don't like as racist and call black conservatives white nationalists etc.. The other is saying that there should be diversity of opinions including ones that may be uncomfortable and even racist because ultimately they believe the bad ones, such as racism will get weeded out. The other issue is that the race card has become so abused in the US that it has lost meaning. When black conservatives are labelled white nationalists 1+1 is not equaling 2.
- tptacek 8y ago
  Candice Owens is a crackpot. If she's the best rhetorical card you have to play, you don't have much of an argument. She's a failed Youtuber making a second go of it as a political commenter, by way (literally) of Infowars. There are serious black conservatives. Tim Scott, for instance. Michael Steele. Crystal Wright, maybe. Find one of them being called a "white nationalist", rather than trying to read tea leaves out of the reactions to an Internet troll.
  - coupdetaco 8y ago
    Jesse Lee Peterson is also a top black republican influencer among actual american blacks