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There are as many shitty pizza/burger joints and diners as there are shitty restaurants of any other kind.

Z8064k 8y ago
A statement like this has no backing at all. And it's exactly what the parent comment was talking about when they said: "a bias toward thinking society is biased." We can't just conclude that x is true because it seems more fair that it would be true. The universe isn't necessarily fair and equal. We can lie to ourselves and our machine learning models about things like: "there must be an equal number of bad restaurants within each genre of restaurant." But that won't make it true. It will just make our models work less well.
manfredo 8y ago
Are there? It's not entirely inconceivable that certain themed restaurants are worse than average in a given area. It wouldn't be surprising if seafood restaurants aren't as good in areas far from the coast, since ingredients need to travel a longer distance. Even if we assume that there is no degredation of quality, the added logistical cost would mean that savings need to be made elsewhere in order to provide a meal at the same pricepoint.
Mountain_Skies 8y ago
Cilantro is a prominent ingredient in Mexican cuisine. It is also notoriously difficult to clean compared to other produce. Add in that it is prepared and served uncooked and you have a food with a higher likelihood of harboring things that will make you ill. Compare that to something like BBQ that is cooked for extended periods of time and the result isn't bias, it's microbiological reality. If Mexican restaurants are cited more for having ill patrons, it might simply be due to the cuisine using preparation methods that lend themselves more easily to distributing contamination than many other cuisines. No bias necessary.
- thrower123 8y ago
  Also, for a significant portion of the population, cilantro tastes just like harsh lye soap, and will render anything contaminated with it edible but extremely unappetizing.
- forapurpose 8y ago
  Really? Mexican food is inherently a health risk because of cilantro?
microcolonel 8y ago
Other subjective, anecdotal justifications which come to mind: I'm actually pretty sure that, in general, it is easier to make passable burgers, and pizza which is passable to the people who end up consuming it (often intoxicated), than it is to make passable mexican food of the sort which is worth buying from a professional kitchen. The cost, variety, and selection of ingredients, the number of error-prone steps, and general common knowledge all stack up in favour of it being more likely that a pizza or burger joint will satisfy whomever it attracts. Now, these points could fail to pass further scrutiny, but I think the point holds: even if there are "as many shitty pizza/burger joints and diners" as there are "shitty restaurants of any other kind", it could be that people are nonetheless more satisfied with "shitty" burger joints than "shitty" taco stands. Another thing which could easily be a fair source of "bias" may be that people have more positive (or fewer negative) social interactions at pizzerias, burger shops, and diners; maybe they're just more familiar to people who are literate in English (the cohort analyzed here). The other day I went to a well operated burrito shop with an open kitchen, and was minorly poisoned (thankfully I work from home, so the consequences were more humorous than life-altering). That will surely affect my sentiment toward burrito shops, and I think it is fair that it does. Edit: another reply mentions that handling cilantro is error prone and that it contributes to a higher rate of minor poisoning from Mexican food prepared in commercial kitchens. If the goal is to maximize positive sentiment, it is very hard to justify throwing away any signal in that domain, especially one this consistent.

A statement like this has no backing at all. And it's exactly what the parent comment was talking about when they said: "a bias toward thinking society is biased." We can't just conclude that x is true because it seems more fair that it would be true. The universe isn't necessarily fair and equal. We can lie to ourselves and our machine learning models about things like: "there must be an equal number of bad restaurants within each genre of restaurant." But that won't make it true. It will just make our models work less well.

manfredo 8y ago

Are there? It's not entirely inconceivable that certain themed restaurants are worse than average in a given area. It wouldn't be surprising if seafood restaurants aren't as good in areas far from the coast, since ingredients need to travel a longer distance. Even if we assume that there is no degredation of quality, the added logistical cost would mean that savings need to be made elsewhere in order to provide a meal at the same pricepoint.

Mountain_Skies 8y ago

Cilantro is a prominent ingredient in Mexican cuisine. It is also notoriously difficult to clean compared to other produce. Add in that it is prepared and served uncooked and you have a food with a higher likelihood of harboring things that will make you ill. Compare that to something like BBQ that is cooked for extended periods of time and the result isn't bias, it's microbiological reality. If Mexican restaurants are cited more for having ill patrons, it might simply be due to the cuisine using preparation methods that lend themselves more easily to distributing contamination than many other cuisines. No bias necessary.

thrower123 8y ago
Also, for a significant portion of the population, cilantro tastes just like harsh lye soap, and will render anything contaminated with it edible but extremely unappetizing.
forapurpose 8y ago
Really? Mexican food is inherently a health risk because of cilantro?

microcolonel 8y ago

Other subjective, anecdotal justifications which come to mind: I'm actually pretty sure that, in general, it is easier to make passable burgers, and pizza which is passable to the people who end up consuming it (often intoxicated), than it is to make passable mexican food of the sort which is worth buying from a professional kitchen. The cost, variety, and selection of ingredients, the number of error-prone steps, and general common knowledge all stack up in favour of it being more likely that a pizza or burger joint will satisfy whomever it attracts. Now, these points could fail to pass further scrutiny, but I think the point holds: even if there are "as many shitty pizza/burger joints and diners" as there are "shitty restaurants of any other kind", it could be that people are nonetheless more satisfied with "shitty" burger joints than "shitty" taco stands. Another thing which could easily be a fair source of "bias" may be that people have more positive (or fewer negative) social interactions at pizzerias, burger shops, and diners; maybe they're just more familiar to people who are literate in English (the cohort analyzed here). The other day I went to a well operated burrito shop with an open kitchen, and was minorly poisoned (thankfully I work from home, so the consequences were more humorous than life-altering). That will surely affect my sentiment toward burrito shops, and I think it is fair that it does. Edit: another reply mentions that handling cilantro is error prone and that it contributes to a higher rate of minor poisoning from Mexican food prepared in commercial kitchens. If the goal is to maximize positive sentiment, it is very hard to justify throwing away any signal in that domain, especially one this consistent.