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It's an interesting article but it is also worth remembering that western society is not all that far away from this vision. Credit scores are widely used, ther

by adam-a 8y ago

It's an interesting article but it is also worth remembering that western society is not all that far away from this vision. Credit scores are widely used, there are apps for them, they can prevent you from getting housing or loans. A criminal record likewise affects your employment prospects, and many other areas of your life. CCTV may be widespread in China but the USA and UK are still way out in front[0]. Lastly, for the suppression of the guy who uncovered party corruption, just look at the treatment of Snowden or many other whistle blowers. 0 - https://www.statista.com/statistics/484956/number-of-surveillance-cameras-per-thousand-people-by-country/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/484956/number-of-surveil...

vthallam 8y ago
stop this "what about the western world". I see this pattern every time there's a critical article about China. When there's an article about the west's censorship, we would be happy to talk about it, but for now, let's focus on the ridiculous and crazy to be put it mildly things going on in China.
- qubax 8y ago
  Why? We are not chinese. We don't live in china. I'm more worried about censorship in the US and especially europe since europeans seem so intent on bringing their censorship to the US and the entire world. At least the chinese censorship affects their country mostly. > I see this pattern every time there's a critical article about China. Because we get the same story about china multiple times in a day. Just from "abc.net.au" within the past 19 hours. The same story has been pushed onto the frontpage. "China’s all-seeing surveillance network" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18030655 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18030655 "China is building a digital dictatorship to exert control over its 1.4B citizens" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18026060 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18026060 I'd called this propaganda rather than news. > let's focus on the ridiculous and crazy to be put it mildly things going on in China. Why? If china wanted to export their dictatorship to the US, I can see why we should be concerned. But they aren't. It's primarily europe and segments of puritanical leftists and rightist in the US along with parts of the tech leadership. It's fine to have a story about china once in a while, but multiple times daily just reeks of propaganda.
  - pas 8y ago
    China is already exporting its dictatorship (influence = power), look at their One Belt One Road project, and the predatory loans to African states. And don't forget the clashes and island building on the South China Sea.
    - adam-a 8y ago
      It remains to be seen whether the OBOR loans are predatory or not. Most of the projects are still underway at this point.
  - woodandsteel 8y ago
    >Why? We are not chinese. We don't live in china. I'm more worried about censorship in the US and especially europe since europeans seem so intent on bringing their censorship to the US and the entire world. At least the chinese censorship affects their country mostly. I strongly disagree. As a human being, you should be concerned with the well-being of humans everywhere in the world, not just your own country.
- adam-a 8y ago
  I don't like the sound of this change in China, I agree with you on that. I think this article does veer into xenophobia a bit though and it's good to offer a counter point to that.
hueving 8y ago
>CCTV may be widespread in China but the USA and UK are still way out in front[0] That's extremely misleading to the point of being propaganda, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. The vast majority of the CCTV's in the US aren't hooked up to any kind of network that delivers data back to the federal (or even state/local) government. They are just security cameras purchased by companies for their own security. That difference is critical because they're not allowing tracking. (NOTE: I speak for the US, the UK could be significantly different) >Lastly, for the suppression of the guy who uncovered party corruption, just look at the treatment of Snowden or many other whistle blowers. Whataboutism and Snowden wasn't uncovering corruption. He was revealing the gross freedom the NSA is permitted to act with under the current US laws.

by adam-a 8y ago

vthallam 8y ago

stop this "what about the western world". I see this pattern every time there's a critical article about China. When there's an article about the west's censorship, we would be happy to talk about it, but for now, let's focus on the ridiculous and crazy to be put it mildly things going on in China.

qubax 8y ago
Why? We are not chinese. We don't live in china. I'm more worried about censorship in the US and especially europe since europeans seem so intent on bringing their censorship to the US and the entire world. At least the chinese censorship affects their country mostly. > I see this pattern every time there's a critical article about China. Because we get the same story about china multiple times in a day. Just from "abc.net.au" within the past 19 hours. The same story has been pushed onto the frontpage. "China’s all-seeing surveillance network" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18030655 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18030655 "China is building a digital dictatorship to exert control over its 1.4B citizens" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18026060 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18026060 I'd called this propaganda rather than news. > let's focus on the ridiculous and crazy to be put it mildly things going on in China. Why? If china wanted to export their dictatorship to the US, I can see why we should be concerned. But they aren't. It's primarily europe and segments of puritanical leftists and rightist in the US along with parts of the tech leadership. It's fine to have a story about china once in a while, but multiple times daily just reeks of propaganda.
- pas 8y ago
  China is already exporting its dictatorship (influence = power), look at their One Belt One Road project, and the predatory loans to African states. And don't forget the clashes and island building on the South China Sea.
  - adam-a 8y ago
    It remains to be seen whether the OBOR loans are predatory or not. Most of the projects are still underway at this point.
- woodandsteel 8y ago
  >Why? We are not chinese. We don't live in china. I'm more worried about censorship in the US and especially europe since europeans seem so intent on bringing their censorship to the US and the entire world. At least the chinese censorship affects their country mostly. I strongly disagree. As a human being, you should be concerned with the well-being of humans everywhere in the world, not just your own country.
adam-a 8y ago
I don't like the sound of this change in China, I agree with you on that. I think this article does veer into xenophobia a bit though and it's good to offer a counter point to that.

hueving 8y ago

>CCTV may be widespread in China but the USA and UK are still way out in front[0] That's extremely misleading to the point of being propaganda, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. The vast majority of the CCTV's in the US aren't hooked up to any kind of network that delivers data back to the federal (or even state/local) government. They are just security cameras purchased by companies for their own security. That difference is critical because they're not allowing tracking. (NOTE: I speak for the US, the UK could be significantly different) >Lastly, for the suppression of the guy who uncovered party corruption, just look at the treatment of Snowden or many other whistle blowers. Whataboutism and Snowden wasn't uncovering corruption. He was revealing the gross freedom the NSA is permitted to act with under the current US laws.