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I think they are harmful in the same way that sexual harassment training is harmful: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/11/upshot/sexual-harassment-workplace-preve

I think they are harmful in the same way that sexual harassment training is harmful: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/11/upshot/sexual-harassment-workplace-prevention-effective.html https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/11/upshot/sexual-harassment-.... It doesn't work at best and it definitely strongly polarises some people into pro/con camps. That being said, it is funny that nobody would bat an eye at signing a code of conduct when they sign up for a gym membership or to volunteer for the YMCA, but signing a code of conduct to enter a restaurant or pub would feel really obnoxious. In all cases an obnoxious patron would be ejected. Maybe when a code of conduct is presented alongside some other typical agreement it seems more appropriate?

klmr 8y ago
Thanks, this is a very insightful comment (and the NYT article confirms a suspicion of mine about workplace sexual harassment training — although here in Europe the legal situation is a bit different). > Maybe when a code of conduct is presented alongside some other typical agreement it seems more appropriate? Funny, this is exactly what I’ve done on personal projects. The CoC is simply a part of the contributors’ guidelines, next to things like submission guidelines and code style.
- BlackFly 8y ago
  Yeah, if you put it right there from the start you can avoid the political polarisation event at its introduction. I feel like in the early days of the internet people acted like the interactions with other people weren't "real" interactions and that people shouldn't be upset at conversations that wouldn't occur at the grimiest of dive bars. It seems this aspect of online culture pervaded some aspects of developer culture as well (it seems some really unprofessional behavior is tolerated in some places). Having a code of conduct that essentially says, "We expect you to behave in our online community like you would at a company barbecue," can get there. I don't think calling attention to particular types of bad behavior is a good idea. Nobody has succeeded in drawing a bright line through gray areas yet.
alyptik 8y ago
Yes, that was a large part of my point. In real life most of the time we deal with problems as they come up; you can't fit humans into these cookie cutter molds we are currently attempting to with these CoCs going around.

klmr 8y ago

Thanks, this is a very insightful comment (and the NYT article confirms a suspicion of mine about workplace sexual harassment training — although here in Europe the legal situation is a bit different). > Maybe when a code of conduct is presented alongside some other typical agreement it seems more appropriate? Funny, this is exactly what I’ve done on personal projects. The CoC is simply a part of the contributors’ guidelines, next to things like submission guidelines and code style.

BlackFly 8y ago
Yeah, if you put it right there from the start you can avoid the political polarisation event at its introduction. I feel like in the early days of the internet people acted like the interactions with other people weren't "real" interactions and that people shouldn't be upset at conversations that wouldn't occur at the grimiest of dive bars. It seems this aspect of online culture pervaded some aspects of developer culture as well (it seems some really unprofessional behavior is tolerated in some places). Having a code of conduct that essentially says, "We expect you to behave in our online community like you would at a company barbecue," can get there. I don't think calling attention to particular types of bad behavior is a good idea. Nobody has succeeded in drawing a bright line through gray areas yet.

alyptik 8y ago

Yes, that was a large part of my point. In real life most of the time we deal with problems as they come up; you can't fit humans into these cookie cutter molds we are currently attempting to with these CoCs going around.