5 ms·

I think the main problem with the author of the article is that he's still essentially reacting passively to the world around him. He's acting in response to th

by girzel 8y ago

I think the main problem with the author of the article is that he's still essentially reacting passively to the world around him. He's acting in response to things that bump up against him -- maybe he's trying to assess whether they're important or worth doing, but he's still fundamentally passive. The difference between him and his friend who does the triathlon is -- there's no one who looks at the clock early in the evening, glances around their apartment, then checks their phone real quick, then says, "I guess I'll train for a triathlon." That's the sort of desire or goal that comes at a different moment in time, perhaps while you're doing something else, or you're caught between things. And you think, "Shit, I should run a triathlon". Once you've had that thought, when you get home from work your first thought is, "when do I train for my triathlon?" And once that's done, you fit the rest of the crap in any which way. The point being, start out with one or more positive, active goals. Prioritize them (as acconrad has said). Everything else just sifts in afterwards. It could be raising your kid, or volunteering for local politics, or playing the piano. Do something first and foremost, something you have decided to do, and you'll find you somehow still have time for all the other crap. (Or you'll find that you don't, and it doesn't matter.)

projektir 8y ago
> you fit the rest of the crap in any which way This is really the only relevant thing here, and effectively amounts to "spend less time on these things", "half ass them more", or "don't do these things". Which is fine, and I think the subconscious point of this article is that if you focus on what a "proper" person should do, you'll run out of time real fast, and generally people need to cut corners. And that advice that adds a daily time drain is questionable. I don't really know anyone who does it all.
- darkerside 8y ago
  Alternative strategy, get really fucking good at doing those things. Then you can get them done in a quarter of the time (compared to someone like the author), and you'll have a decent box of time to fill with doing things you love.
  - taurath 8y ago
    You can replace a daily 1 hour cooking with a 3 hour Sunday meal prep and save 4 hours for a week - you can spend 5 hours automating you lawn being watered, but probably not automate cutting it. There’s only so much time one can save.
    - darkerside 8y ago
      Lawn cutting services are cheap and straightforward. Can't think of many things easier to automate.
      - taurath 8y ago
        Yes, and when you automate too many things with other people's labor it ends up getting expensive. Even if you have money, its not really much time savings - 30 minutes a week? The point here is for even an above average worker the daily expectations of the modern lifestyle can overwhelm even a budget minded person, or a couple with kids.
  - projektir 8y ago
    Sort of, but a lot of these things are either time bound or not in your control. I think if they were so easy to optimize, most would have already optimized them. Exercise is often time gated. It's not something you want to rush in many cases. Definitely not foam rolling. Exercise also often incurs logistical costs (i.e., getting here). [no, your optimization techniques for at-home body weight are not welcome here] Meditation is not really prone to that. Doctor visits you can't control. Or haircuts. Calls and visits to bureaucracies you can't control. Social time fundamentally is not something you want to squeeze. There's also a danger with getting spazzy if you optimize too much. I think the bigger issue is too much crap for a person to take care of. Too many things to remember and schedule when they should just happen. I think it's an externality that is being captured by no one and it will get worse with time and we won't notice because we'll just call people who fail inferior.
    - darkerside 8y ago
- ohohoho 8y ago
  Exactly what I was trying to get at! Thank you.
taurath 8y ago
Having some long term goal and thing to work towards can definitely help. How to focus enough to figure out those goals can be very difficult, but knowing that you need a goal is a first step.
ohohoho 8y ago
You're right about being active, but it's hard to have such a strong sense of identity and worldview-- to just say: I'm going to structure my life around training for a triathalon. I feel like there are so many parts of life I want to explore to see if I'd like them. I and a lot of people my age haven't found our 'triathalon' and I'm worried about not having enough time to find it. Also, the post was more about there being so many recommendations and 'upkeep tasks' for being healthy and functional. I don't see how assessing whether things are worth doing is 'fundamentally passive'.
- girzel 8y ago
  Wait until you're 40! The things that are important to you will make themselves known. I'm 40 and have decided the things that matter are my family, writing, piano, taiji, and baking, in that order. A short list, but each one of those things could reward a lifetime of dedicated exploration, and each of them (okay maybe not baking) yields arbitrary philosophical depths. I need to spend time on other stuff, too, but I get that stuff out of the way as soon as I can. "Upkeep tasks" are never worth making your main focus. Fooling with diets, the quantified life, exercise regimens... these are not worth making the focus of life. They make you healthy and functional -- for what? You need something to be healthy and functional for. Start with that thing (or things), and work backwards. You can't make oiling your wheels (or tending to your .emacs file) the whole point. And I don't mean we all need some all-fired existential purpose in life, I just mean we need something we've decided to do. If you're not yet 40... uh... hang in there. Sorry, this might be my first ever man-on-the-mountain, lemme-tell-you-how-things-are post, and I don't mean to make a habit of it. But I've got some years behind me, and a lot of mistakes, and this is something I feel pretty confident about.

by girzel 8y ago

projektir 8y ago

> you fit the rest of the crap in any which way This is really the only relevant thing here, and effectively amounts to "spend less time on these things", "half ass them more", or "don't do these things". Which is fine, and I think the subconscious point of this article is that if you focus on what a "proper" person should do, you'll run out of time real fast, and generally people need to cut corners. And that advice that adds a daily time drain is questionable. I don't really know anyone who does it all.

darkerside 8y ago
Alternative strategy, get really fucking good at doing those things. Then you can get them done in a quarter of the time (compared to someone like the author), and you'll have a decent box of time to fill with doing things you love.
- taurath 8y ago
  You can replace a daily 1 hour cooking with a 3 hour Sunday meal prep and save 4 hours for a week - you can spend 5 hours automating you lawn being watered, but probably not automate cutting it. There’s only so much time one can save.
  - darkerside 8y ago
    Lawn cutting services are cheap and straightforward. Can't think of many things easier to automate.
    - taurath 8y ago
      Yes, and when you automate too many things with other people's labor it ends up getting expensive. Even if you have money, its not really much time savings - 30 minutes a week? The point here is for even an above average worker the daily expectations of the modern lifestyle can overwhelm even a budget minded person, or a couple with kids.
- projektir 8y ago
  Sort of, but a lot of these things are either time bound or not in your control. I think if they were so easy to optimize, most would have already optimized them. Exercise is often time gated. It's not something you want to rush in many cases. Definitely not foam rolling. Exercise also often incurs logistical costs (i.e., getting here). [no, your optimization techniques for at-home body weight are not welcome here] Meditation is not really prone to that. Doctor visits you can't control. Or haircuts. Calls and visits to bureaucracies you can't control. Social time fundamentally is not something you want to squeeze. There's also a danger with getting spazzy if you optimize too much. I think the bigger issue is too much crap for a person to take care of. Too many things to remember and schedule when they should just happen. I think it's an externality that is being captured by no one and it will get worse with time and we won't notice because we'll just call people who fail inferior.
  - darkerside 8y ago
ohohoho 8y ago
Exactly what I was trying to get at! Thank you.

taurath 8y ago

Having some long term goal and thing to work towards can definitely help. How to focus enough to figure out those goals can be very difficult, but knowing that you need a goal is a first step.

ohohoho 8y ago

You're right about being active, but it's hard to have such a strong sense of identity and worldview-- to just say: I'm going to structure my life around training for a triathalon. I feel like there are so many parts of life I want to explore to see if I'd like them. I and a lot of people my age haven't found our 'triathalon' and I'm worried about not having enough time to find it. Also, the post was more about there being so many recommendations and 'upkeep tasks' for being healthy and functional. I don't see how assessing whether things are worth doing is 'fundamentally passive'.

girzel 8y ago
Wait until you're 40! The things that are important to you will make themselves known. I'm 40 and have decided the things that matter are my family, writing, piano, taiji, and baking, in that order. A short list, but each one of those things could reward a lifetime of dedicated exploration, and each of them (okay maybe not baking) yields arbitrary philosophical depths. I need to spend time on other stuff, too, but I get that stuff out of the way as soon as I can. "Upkeep tasks" are never worth making your main focus. Fooling with diets, the quantified life, exercise regimens... these are not worth making the focus of life. They make you healthy and functional -- for what? You need something to be healthy and functional for. Start with that thing (or things), and work backwards. You can't make oiling your wheels (or tending to your .emacs file) the whole point. And I don't mean we all need some all-fired existential purpose in life, I just mean we need something we've decided to do. If you're not yet 40... uh... hang in there. Sorry, this might be my first ever man-on-the-mountain, lemme-tell-you-how-things-are post, and I don't mean to make a habit of it. But I've got some years behind me, and a lot of mistakes, and this is something I feel pretty confident about.