3 ms·

What’s the system/mechanism that doesn’t “allow” them to do it on their own. A legal disclaimer? That isn’t sufficient, You can’t contract around the law. In

What’s the system/mechanism that doesn’t “allow” them to do it on their own. A legal disclaimer? That isn’t sufficient, You can’t contract around the law. In other words a minor can’t enter a contract, therefore, I can’t contract with a minor and include a provision that says the minor isn’t a minor and if they are then they got parental consent. Google is the master of information. It would strike me if any company knew or should have known a user signing up for their service is a minor it should be them. Google literally makes it available to minors to agree to these contracts, so when you say google doesn’t allow them to...what do you really mean?

yorwba 8y ago
According to https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338#signup_fee https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338#signup_fe... the verification mechanism is to use a credit card, which is one of the methods listed as "reasonably calculated" under point H.4 of this FAQ https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-coppa-frequently-asked-questions#Verifiable%20Parental https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/com...
- will_brown 8y ago
  It’s clever of Google to tie verification to the parents credit card...of course in practice, in no way does that serve as actual verification a minor has consent of the parent to sign up for the Google service (I think we saw this is in enough cases with minors making in app purchases with parents credit card thru the App Store) but surely it places the parent in an unenviable position to make a claim Google unlawfully collected information on their child without parental consent even when true.
  - jchw 8y ago
    Okay, I'll go to work and suggest we delete all user accounts since it's impossible to verify that the users are above the age of 13.
    - will_brown 8y ago
      Snark aside, it is difficult to comply with the law and Google (amount others) is exposing themselves to potential liability by engaging in the collection of user data for users under the age of 13. Google is in a particularly difficult position because facts/evidence would show they knew or should know users are under 13 in many (not all instances) even when the users lie. But you are wrong it’s not impossible to verify users age, and Google doesn’t have to delete user accounts...they can simply stop collecting user data of minors 13 and younger ;) Edit: another loosely related example (dealing with age verification) is Girls Gone Wild where they paid underage girls to reveal themselves on camera, those minors signed the GGW contracts and provided fake IDs...yet GGW was liable.
      - jchw 8y ago
        Hard to have no snark. You've provided zero useful input on how to deal with this, and expensive lawyers with more school than you disagree that what is done now is not sufficient.
        will_brown 8y ago
        What helpful input have you added? Why do you think other lawyers have “more school” than me? As you acknowledge Google is paying some expensive in-house and outside counsel, I disagree with you that they wouldn’t agree with me. I’m sure in an attempt to minimize legal risks and potential liability they would have offered the exact solutions I have, but executives (as they often do) ignore counsel, thinking they know better, and expose themselves to the legal risks in order to collect data on children 13 and under to monetize them. Anyway if you can show me your input, or support any of your claims (show me a lawyer with “more school” than me, or a lawyer who disagrees) that would be at least something more than trolling.

yorwba 8y ago

According to https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338#signup_fee https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338#signup_fe... the verification mechanism is to use a credit card, which is one of the methods listed as "reasonably calculated" under point H.4 of this FAQ https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-coppa-frequently-asked-questions#Verifiable%20Parental https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/com...

will_brown 8y ago
It’s clever of Google to tie verification to the parents credit card...of course in practice, in no way does that serve as actual verification a minor has consent of the parent to sign up for the Google service (I think we saw this is in enough cases with minors making in app purchases with parents credit card thru the App Store) but surely it places the parent in an unenviable position to make a claim Google unlawfully collected information on their child without parental consent even when true.
- jchw 8y ago
  Okay, I'll go to work and suggest we delete all user accounts since it's impossible to verify that the users are above the age of 13.
  - will_brown 8y ago
    Snark aside, it is difficult to comply with the law and Google (amount others) is exposing themselves to potential liability by engaging in the collection of user data for users under the age of 13. Google is in a particularly difficult position because facts/evidence would show they knew or should know users are under 13 in many (not all instances) even when the users lie. But you are wrong it’s not impossible to verify users age, and Google doesn’t have to delete user accounts...they can simply stop collecting user data of minors 13 and younger ;) Edit: another loosely related example (dealing with age verification) is Girls Gone Wild where they paid underage girls to reveal themselves on camera, those minors signed the GGW contracts and provided fake IDs...yet GGW was liable.
    - jchw 8y ago
      Hard to have no snark. You've provided zero useful input on how to deal with this, and expensive lawyers with more school than you disagree that what is done now is not sufficient.
      - will_brown 8y ago
        What helpful input have you added? Why do you think other lawyers have “more school” than me? As you acknowledge Google is paying some expensive in-house and outside counsel, I disagree with you that they wouldn’t agree with me. I’m sure in an attempt to minimize legal risks and potential liability they would have offered the exact solutions I have, but executives (as they often do) ignore counsel, thinking they know better, and expose themselves to the legal risks in order to collect data on children 13 and under to monetize them. Anyway if you can show me your input, or support any of your claims (show me a lawyer with “more school” than me, or a lawyer who disagrees) that would be at least something more than trolling.