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This is an almost uniquely American point of view. To obtain this freedom you must : 1. Get a license and learn to drive 2. Buy or lease a large, rarely utili

This is an almost uniquely American point of view. To obtain this freedom you must : 1. Get a license and learn to drive 2. Buy or lease a large, rarely utilised machine 3. Keep it maintained 4. Keep it fuelled 5. Ensure your tax dollars are spent on enormous infrastructure projects 6. Continue paying for the maintenance of said infrastructure 7. Undergo the significant risk of getting in a vehicle, and impose higher risks on all those around you 8. Pollute the air around you with fumes 9. Warp the development of all living spaces around you to suit your convenience, regardless of cost or benefit Your freedom sounds like my tyranny.

jimmaswell 8y ago
1. Easy in the US 2. You can get a good reliable used car for under $1000 easily, and I use mine every day 3. Not a big deal 4. 3 5. I don't mind paying taxes for infrastructure 6. 5 7. Acceptable risk for the massive benefit to me 8. Efficiency is constantly improving and there are no emissions from an EV 9. How is that any different from how we shape the landscape for our own benefit in every other way?
- bobthepanda 8y ago
  40 hours a week at federal minimum wage is $15,000. AAA considers average car ownership cost to be at $6,000 a year. https://www.moneycrashers.com/living-without-car/ https://www.moneycrashers.com/living-without-car/ That is a ridiculous cost to just throw on poor people. And this is assuming a poor person has a full time job with no dependents, and has no other competing concerns for money.
  - jimmaswell 8y ago
    I didn't say it's not good for poor people to have other options, I just said it feels more like freedom to me having the choice of driving.
  - adrianN 8y ago
    The average car ownership cost is probably not very relevant for the type of cars that people on minimum wage drive.
    - bobthepanda 8y ago
      Generally lower purchase cost, but higher maintenance. And older cars generally have poorer mileage. This is of course, also assuming that they didn't get a subprime auto loan to get that car in the first place. Subprime auto defaults are increasing: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-02/never-mind-defaults-debt-backed-by-subprime-auto-loans-is-hot https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-02/never-min...

jimmaswell 8y ago

1. Easy in the US 2. You can get a good reliable used car for under $1000 easily, and I use mine every day 3. Not a big deal 4. 3 5. I don't mind paying taxes for infrastructure 6. 5 7. Acceptable risk for the massive benefit to me 8. Efficiency is constantly improving and there are no emissions from an EV 9. How is that any different from how we shape the landscape for our own benefit in every other way?

bobthepanda 8y ago
40 hours a week at federal minimum wage is $15,000. AAA considers average car ownership cost to be at $6,000 a year. https://www.moneycrashers.com/living-without-car/ https://www.moneycrashers.com/living-without-car/ That is a ridiculous cost to just throw on poor people. And this is assuming a poor person has a full time job with no dependents, and has no other competing concerns for money.
- jimmaswell 8y ago
  I didn't say it's not good for poor people to have other options, I just said it feels more like freedom to me having the choice of driving.
- adrianN 8y ago
  The average car ownership cost is probably not very relevant for the type of cars that people on minimum wage drive.
  - bobthepanda 8y ago
    Generally lower purchase cost, but higher maintenance. And older cars generally have poorer mileage. This is of course, also assuming that they didn't get a subprime auto loan to get that car in the first place. Subprime auto defaults are increasing: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-02/never-mind-defaults-debt-backed-by-subprime-auto-loans-is-hot https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-02/never-min...