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We need a new labor movement. The control corporations have over the average worker is getting troublesome for society. Between non compete clauses, cartel-like

We need a new labor movement. The control corporations have over the average worker is getting troublesome for society. Between non compete clauses, cartel-like salary caps and anti-union stances, no wonder real wages haven't risen in decades. While great for the capital classes, it is long term detrimental to the stability of society.

knightofmars 8y ago
I'm not sure whey you're getting down voted. Everything you said contributes to wage problems.
- Ensorceled 8y ago
  Many people have been convinced that the labour movement is evil. Including those that would benefit from being unionized. Actually, especially those who would benefit.
  - ryandrake 8y ago
    You’ll always get a handful of downvotes here by mentioning anything positive about organized labor or use the U-word. It’s as reliable as the sun. Best not to sweat it.
    - gaius 8y ago
      It’s time based. If I say anything about it it will be upvoted in European hours and downvoted as soon as the West Coast comes online.
- jorblumesea 8y ago
  There are some that visit HN that are highly paid and often of a different class in society. There's a remarkable lack of sympathy displayed by some small subset of HN readers towards those less fortunate. At least in American society, classism is a huge issue and prevents a lot of good being done in the world. > Poor? it's simple, just get an ivy league degree in engineering and get hired at [insert big tech company here]
  - rchaud 8y ago
    I would wager there are just as many on HN in the "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" camp. They side against pro-labour practices, using many of the same arguments made by rich industrialists, because they feel it's only a matter of time before they themselves reach the top of the heap.
zackmorris 8y ago
Ya I agree. I've worked in several disciplines here in Idaho - working for myself writing software for 20+ years, moving furniture for a warehouse for 3 years, computer repair for 3 years, freelance contracting and consulting for at least 5 years. In most cases employees could be at-will terminated, the pay disparity between the company's hourly rate and what it pays were rather high, and employees had little or no ownership of the business. This last point is most important IMHO. I think the very simplest step to remedying labor-capitalist relations in the US is to change the corporate mandate to maximizing worker quality of life instead of maximizing shareholder value. This would basically mean that corporate boards would be > 50% workers and that work (earned income) would always be taxed less than capital gains (unearned income). This could be obtained through unions or by new legislation at the state/federal level. Richard Wolff has many videos on YouTube about it. Unfortunately since this is the US of A, democracy has been conflated with capitalism and most people seem to have forgotten that our country was founded on the principle of no taxation without representation. I argue that since wages are so low now, we're all paying an effective 50% tax to the private sector, which gets vacuumed up by the very wealthy or moved out of the country to exploit even poorer people. Our income goes to rents, school (which used to be public), medical care (which is public in most other countries), etc etc etc. It would be more profitable for the middle class to do these workplace reforms and make 2-4 times as much income at a slightly higher tax rate than we have now. The above is the most logical, succinct way I can put it, because I have firsthand experience in how the current system isn't working and isn't sustainable. And I've had it relatively easy compared to people struggling with 2-3 jobs and children to support. But the level of vitriol I get from friends and family that agree with me on most things (except politics!) is just incredible.
justizin 8y ago
And to be clear, these WeWork non-competes are expressly about union busting. A few months ago, the WeWork I was in at the time went from in-house cleaning and facilities staff to a contract, keeping about 1/3 of the same individuals. It's unclear what exactly happened, but we were fairly sure the workers tried to organize. WeWork wants to prevent people from even being able to transfer to the company they contract out to after firing people, is my belief.

knightofmars 8y ago

I'm not sure whey you're getting down voted. Everything you said contributes to wage problems.

Ensorceled 8y ago
Many people have been convinced that the labour movement is evil. Including those that would benefit from being unionized. Actually, especially those who would benefit.
- ryandrake 8y ago
  You’ll always get a handful of downvotes here by mentioning anything positive about organized labor or use the U-word. It’s as reliable as the sun. Best not to sweat it.
  - gaius 8y ago
    It’s time based. If I say anything about it it will be upvoted in European hours and downvoted as soon as the West Coast comes online.
jorblumesea 8y ago
There are some that visit HN that are highly paid and often of a different class in society. There's a remarkable lack of sympathy displayed by some small subset of HN readers towards those less fortunate. At least in American society, classism is a huge issue and prevents a lot of good being done in the world. > Poor? it's simple, just get an ivy league degree in engineering and get hired at [insert big tech company here]
- rchaud 8y ago
  I would wager there are just as many on HN in the "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" camp. They side against pro-labour practices, using many of the same arguments made by rich industrialists, because they feel it's only a matter of time before they themselves reach the top of the heap.

zackmorris 8y ago

Ya I agree. I've worked in several disciplines here in Idaho - working for myself writing software for 20+ years, moving furniture for a warehouse for 3 years, computer repair for 3 years, freelance contracting and consulting for at least 5 years. In most cases employees could be at-will terminated, the pay disparity between the company's hourly rate and what it pays were rather high, and employees had little or no ownership of the business. This last point is most important IMHO. I think the very simplest step to remedying labor-capitalist relations in the US is to change the corporate mandate to maximizing worker quality of life instead of maximizing shareholder value. This would basically mean that corporate boards would be > 50% workers and that work (earned income) would always be taxed less than capital gains (unearned income). This could be obtained through unions or by new legislation at the state/federal level. Richard Wolff has many videos on YouTube about it. Unfortunately since this is the US of A, democracy has been conflated with capitalism and most people seem to have forgotten that our country was founded on the principle of no taxation without representation. I argue that since wages are so low now, we're all paying an effective 50% tax to the private sector, which gets vacuumed up by the very wealthy or moved out of the country to exploit even poorer people. Our income goes to rents, school (which used to be public), medical care (which is public in most other countries), etc etc etc. It would be more profitable for the middle class to do these workplace reforms and make 2-4 times as much income at a slightly higher tax rate than we have now. The above is the most logical, succinct way I can put it, because I have firsthand experience in how the current system isn't working and isn't sustainable. And I've had it relatively easy compared to people struggling with 2-3 jobs and children to support. But the level of vitriol I get from friends and family that agree with me on most things (except politics!) is just incredible.

justizin 8y ago

And to be clear, these WeWork non-competes are expressly about union busting. A few months ago, the WeWork I was in at the time went from in-house cleaning and facilities staff to a contract, keeping about 1/3 of the same individuals. It's unclear what exactly happened, but we were fairly sure the workers tried to organize. WeWork wants to prevent people from even being able to transfer to the company they contract out to after firing people, is my belief.