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We wanted to create a routing app for bikes, which would take in consideration cliffs, dangerous streets and the likes. With our internal team, we’ve managed t

by haolez 8y ago

We wanted to create a routing app for bikes, which would take in consideration cliffs, dangerous streets and the likes. With our internal team, we’ve managed to create a killer backend that would do all the hard routing stuff without issues. It was better than Google Maps in most cases! Now, we just needed the app. We used all our money to pay a third party contractor to make the app, and they failed miserably. We never received a working prototype. We ran out of gas. The backend still exists, in case anyone wants to give the app a shot. I might release the backend as open source. Ping me if this interests you.

skunkworker 8y ago
You should write up a Medium article with some test results showing off the backend. You may be able to get someone to buy it before going open source.
blazespin 8y ago
Yeah, frontend work is routinely under estimated. You are not the first.
- Drdrdrq 8y ago
  Yeah. It's not just frontend, you need to figure out the UX too. Backend is usually easy compared to this.
  - haolez 8y ago
    The backend was damn hard. But so was the app! Routing and navigation is a tough domain.
ummonk 8y ago
That sounds really impressive. Definitely interested in seeing what you've got (and an open source release would be cool)!
mohammed_aybits 8y ago
Hi, this is Mohammed here. Ours is a startup, we have expertise in app developent. You can send a link to us at mohammed@aybits.com so that we can have the backend and give the app a shot.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
KhoomeiK 8y ago
Hey, we're working in the space of navigation by bike as well, though not in the exact same way as your startup from what I understand. It would be awesome if you could share your backend with us (email: rohan.pandey at gmail). Thanks!
michaelvoz 8y ago
Uber advanced technologies, routing tech lead here. This sounds interesting. Lets chat? You can email me: michaelv at uber
ckastner 8y ago
> We used all our money to pay a third party contractor to make the app, and they failed miserably Where did you hire/find the third party contractor? Friends of mine, in two separate startups, got burnt badly by those outfits that offer the "native apps for iOS and Android" package for $10K or so. I talked to some of those "developers" once, when I helped my friend troubleshoot an issue. It was horrible. They were so inept, they couldn't solve a problem if you provided a solution to them (literally -- they failed at copy-pasting).
- skunkworker 8y ago
  And then they want you to sign a document or email saying that they did all they would say and just rip people off when they think, "oh an iOS app with backend for $5000".
- haolez 8y ago
  We found them in Google. They were from the same country as us. They were really bad. One of the versions of their _navigation_ app would not navigate - the GPS simply wouldn't track the user in the app's map. It was a really frustrating experience.
scabarott 8y ago
I didn't quite understand this. Presumably, you're developers and just created a I assume fairly complex backend product (better than Google Maps). What stopped even just one of you from picking up a book on react-native/electron/whatever and knocking out a workable front-end? Did you exceed your runway, run out of time etc? edit: to clarify, I meant after the third-party didn't work out. Also not critiquing just genuinely curious
- haolez 8y ago
  I simplified the story a little bit, but two factors contributed to the sad outcome: 1. making a _live routing_ app is tougher than it looks 2. our team was really emotionally exhausted after this (the whole process consumed around 2 years) and some key team members needed some time off But yeah, it could have been possible to make the app ourselves.
  - scabarott 8y ago
    I hear you, and appreciate your honesty. Not many founders talk a lot about the technical challenges of building the app itself. A lot of startup stories I read take this as a given, whereas I'm sure it's one of the biggest factors if not the biggest that causes many startups to fail.
zeuslawyer 8y ago
I would love to see the backend open sourced as well, as I think this is something that could be quite unique to each country. I'm in Melbourne, Australia and biking safety is a big deal here - i ride everywhere. The uniqueness of each area would lend itself well to localisation via open source. I'm at zubin.pratap at gmail - do let me know!
- haolez 8y ago
  I’m trying to squeeze in some time to do that. Will make sure to ping you if it happens.
stratosmacker 8y ago
Please release this, the OpenStreet Maps community could really benefit from a better routing system
kguebert 8y ago
I've been working recently on something semi-similar for runners - calculating elevation gain, difficulty, route generation, etc. First time around I was using Mapbox API but ran into some difficulties and have since switch to Google Maps which still isn't exactly what I'm looking for. Would be interested in learning more about your backend if you don't mind sharing - kguebert93 @ gmail.com
webmaven 8y ago
This sounds interesting to me (the releasing as open source bit, in particular). What's the backend tech stack?
- haolez 8y ago
  A combination of PostgreSQL + PostGIS + pgRouting, Java + GraphHopper and my personal favorite: PostgREST!
  - steve-chavez 8y ago
    Hey haolez, glad to hear you like PostgREST :)(I'm the current maintainer). If you manage to open source your project please stop by our docs repo, would be great to have a real world PostGIS project in our ecosystem list.
    - haolez 8y ago
      Will do! Congratulations, btw. PostgREST is incredibly stable :)
  - webmaven 8y ago
    Sounds like the folks at https://osgeo.org https://osgeo.org might be interested...

by haolez 8y ago

skunkworker 8y ago

You should write up a Medium article with some test results showing off the backend. You may be able to get someone to buy it before going open source.

blazespin 8y ago

Yeah, frontend work is routinely under estimated. You are not the first.

Drdrdrq 8y ago
Yeah. It's not just frontend, you need to figure out the UX too. Backend is usually easy compared to this.
- haolez 8y ago
  The backend was damn hard. But so was the app! Routing and navigation is a tough domain.

ummonk 8y ago

That sounds really impressive. Definitely interested in seeing what you've got (and an open source release would be cool)!

mohammed_aybits 8y ago

Hi, this is Mohammed here. Ours is a startup, we have expertise in app developent. You can send a link to us at mohammed@aybits.com so that we can have the backend and give the app a shot.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

KhoomeiK 8y ago

Hey, we're working in the space of navigation by bike as well, though not in the exact same way as your startup from what I understand. It would be awesome if you could share your backend with us (email: rohan.pandey at gmail). Thanks!

michaelvoz 8y ago

Uber advanced technologies, routing tech lead here. This sounds interesting. Lets chat? You can email me: michaelv at uber

ckastner 8y ago

> We used all our money to pay a third party contractor to make the app, and they failed miserably Where did you hire/find the third party contractor? Friends of mine, in two separate startups, got burnt badly by those outfits that offer the "native apps for iOS and Android" package for $10K or so. I talked to some of those "developers" once, when I helped my friend troubleshoot an issue. It was horrible. They were so inept, they couldn't solve a problem if you provided a solution to them (literally -- they failed at copy-pasting).

skunkworker 8y ago
And then they want you to sign a document or email saying that they did all they would say and just rip people off when they think, "oh an iOS app with backend for $5000".
haolez 8y ago
We found them in Google. They were from the same country as us. They were really bad. One of the versions of their _navigation_ app would not navigate - the GPS simply wouldn't track the user in the app's map. It was a really frustrating experience.

scabarott 8y ago

I didn't quite understand this. Presumably, you're developers and just created a I assume fairly complex backend product (better than Google Maps). What stopped even just one of you from picking up a book on react-native/electron/whatever and knocking out a workable front-end? Did you exceed your runway, run out of time etc? edit: to clarify, I meant after the third-party didn't work out. Also not critiquing just genuinely curious

haolez 8y ago
I simplified the story a little bit, but two factors contributed to the sad outcome: 1. making a _live routing_ app is tougher than it looks 2. our team was really emotionally exhausted after this (the whole process consumed around 2 years) and some key team members needed some time off But yeah, it could have been possible to make the app ourselves.
- scabarott 8y ago
  I hear you, and appreciate your honesty. Not many founders talk a lot about the technical challenges of building the app itself. A lot of startup stories I read take this as a given, whereas I'm sure it's one of the biggest factors if not the biggest that causes many startups to fail.

zeuslawyer 8y ago

I would love to see the backend open sourced as well, as I think this is something that could be quite unique to each country. I'm in Melbourne, Australia and biking safety is a big deal here - i ride everywhere. The uniqueness of each area would lend itself well to localisation via open source. I'm at zubin.pratap at gmail - do let me know!

haolez 8y ago
I’m trying to squeeze in some time to do that. Will make sure to ping you if it happens.

stratosmacker 8y ago

Please release this, the OpenStreet Maps community could really benefit from a better routing system

kguebert 8y ago

I've been working recently on something semi-similar for runners - calculating elevation gain, difficulty, route generation, etc. First time around I was using Mapbox API but ran into some difficulties and have since switch to Google Maps which still isn't exactly what I'm looking for. Would be interested in learning more about your backend if you don't mind sharing - kguebert93 @ gmail.com

webmaven 8y ago

This sounds interesting to me (the releasing as open source bit, in particular). What's the backend tech stack?

haolez 8y ago
A combination of PostgreSQL + PostGIS + pgRouting, Java + GraphHopper and my personal favorite: PostgREST!
- steve-chavez 8y ago
  Hey haolez, glad to hear you like PostgREST :)(I'm the current maintainer). If you manage to open source your project please stop by our docs repo, would be great to have a real world PostGIS project in our ecosystem list.
  - haolez 8y ago
    Will do! Congratulations, btw. PostgREST is incredibly stable :)
- webmaven 8y ago
  Sounds like the folks at https://osgeo.org https://osgeo.org might be interested...