4 ms·

> I'd rather share the road with a computer. Not version 1. Factoring in all these variables is going to be a lot of work for a non-universal feature. I have

by scj 8y ago

> I'd rather share the road with a computer. Not version 1. Factoring in all these variables is going to be a lot of work for a non-universal feature. I have no doubt they'll be included some day, but I doubt it'll be day 1. EDIT: To be clear, I believe that dealing with ice and snow is an order of magnitude more difficult than driving under normal conditions. This is an 80-20 feature that many people won't need. I can't imagine holding the product back for additional development when just locking the feature based on a thermometer would suffice.

Moru 8y ago
I'm worried about the south europeans jumping into their self-driving car thinking they can come visit us in northern Sweden early spring (their season, still full winter here). How do you meassure how slippery the road is? How much wind from the side? Will the wind blow me off the road because it has been polished by the wind just after those trees end, next to the lake? Will the car know to stop before even going because the car doesn't have winter tyres with good enough tracktion left? A self-driving truck, does it know enough not to slow down in the uphill because it will start to glide sideways or backwards where the road leans too much to the side? I get gray hair when I start thinking of all the problems that needs to be solved before we have self-driving cars. One of the developer voes, am I wise enough to be humble about my limits of knowledge or do I know enough to be dangerous?
- maxerickson 8y ago
  Modern cars can drive at their traction limit already, it's a solved problem. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traction_control_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traction_control_system It's been a safety boon to have a computer limiting power to the wheels when they slip, humans are really bad at estimating how slippery the road is. Estimating for the road ahead is a different problem, but there is data to feed into that estimate.
  - Moru 8y ago
    If you read the manual for the traction control it is full of big warnings on every page,'Does not cancel out physical laws'. It is not a solved problem, it can only do as best it can uphill until car does not have enough traction to continue upwards. At which point the car will slowly glide down or into the ditch.
    - maxerickson 8y ago
      So what's your point? Are you saying human drivers can safely navigate those same hills or something?
      - Tor3 8y ago
        What he's saying is that a human will, in those conditions, build up a speed in advance that is exactly enough to get up there before the speed has dropped too much (due to having to back off on the speed to keep traction. The computer can do the latter, but can it do the former? Probably when we get AI. But we don't have AI. Just machine learning.)
- Faark 8y ago
  You're presuppose individual ownership of self driving cars. Ride hailing replacing those seems like a very likely outcome of self driving tech and won't have your issue thanks to "destination outside service area". Actually, even with private ownership i'd not be surprised we'd end with region locked software, even if just for business reasons.
- saalweachter 8y ago
  How well do the south Europeans jumping into their rental cars and coming up north to tool around on your weird roads fare now?

by scj 8y ago

Moru 8y ago

I'm worried about the south europeans jumping into their self-driving car thinking they can come visit us in northern Sweden early spring (their season, still full winter here). How do you meassure how slippery the road is? How much wind from the side? Will the wind blow me off the road because it has been polished by the wind just after those trees end, next to the lake? Will the car know to stop before even going because the car doesn't have winter tyres with good enough tracktion left? A self-driving truck, does it know enough not to slow down in the uphill because it will start to glide sideways or backwards where the road leans too much to the side? I get gray hair when I start thinking of all the problems that needs to be solved before we have self-driving cars. One of the developer voes, am I wise enough to be humble about my limits of knowledge or do I know enough to be dangerous?

maxerickson 8y ago
Modern cars can drive at their traction limit already, it's a solved problem. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traction_control_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traction_control_system It's been a safety boon to have a computer limiting power to the wheels when they slip, humans are really bad at estimating how slippery the road is. Estimating for the road ahead is a different problem, but there is data to feed into that estimate.
- Moru 8y ago
  If you read the manual for the traction control it is full of big warnings on every page,'Does not cancel out physical laws'. It is not a solved problem, it can only do as best it can uphill until car does not have enough traction to continue upwards. At which point the car will slowly glide down or into the ditch.
  - maxerickson 8y ago
    So what's your point? Are you saying human drivers can safely navigate those same hills or something?
    - Tor3 8y ago
      What he's saying is that a human will, in those conditions, build up a speed in advance that is exactly enough to get up there before the speed has dropped too much (due to having to back off on the speed to keep traction. The computer can do the latter, but can it do the former? Probably when we get AI. But we don't have AI. Just machine learning.)
Faark 8y ago
You're presuppose individual ownership of self driving cars. Ride hailing replacing those seems like a very likely outcome of self driving tech and won't have your issue thanks to "destination outside service area". Actually, even with private ownership i'd not be surprised we'd end with region locked software, even if just for business reasons.
saalweachter 8y ago
How well do the south Europeans jumping into their rental cars and coming up north to tool around on your weird roads fare now?