7 ms·

I was faced with a similar choice two years ago and went with Google. I really didn't enjoy my time there; turns out big companies really aren't my cup of tea.

I was faced with a similar choice two years ago and went with Google. I really didn't enjoy my time there; turns out big companies really aren't my cup of tea. I also learned much less than I would have somewhere else because Google's stack is quite proprietary and I simply wasn't motivated in that environment. I quit after only 8 months. So it may surprise you that I'd recommend taking the Google offer! In my mind, there's no way to lose choosing Google. If it turns out that you love Google, awesome – you can have a great and well-compensated career there. And if it turns out you don't enjoy that kind of shop (like me), your career possibilities will be far wider after a tour of duty at Google than they are right now, including within startups. Google as a resume item will continue paying dividends for as long as it maintains its reputation for engineering excellence. This advice is based on my personal experience – it's almost certain that I wouldn't be in my current role if I hadn't had Google on my resume when I applied. And my current responsibilities, experience and income far exceed what I could have expected on the alternative trajectory at an early-stage startup, unless its growth happened to have exploded while I was there.

Hydraulix989 8y ago
Did you have to return any signing bonuses, relocation, etc in full?
- kcorbitt 8y ago
  I had to return a prorated portion of my signing bonus and relocation expenses. The larger financial hit was that none of my RSUs had vested, so I walked away from those entirely (my understanding is that Google has since changed their policy and RSUs now begin vesting immediately). To be clear, I don't recommend that anyone join Google with the intention of leaving in less than a year. Even though I wasn't particularly enjoying myself, I was planning on staying for ~18 months to pay back Google's investment in my training. In the end though I changed my mind and left earlier because an opportunity came up that was simply too good to refuse.
  - joshuamorton 8y ago
    This is correct. You'll still repost prorated signing and relo, but some of your stock will have vested.
    - Hydraulix989 8y ago
      Surprised there is no one-year cliff now. Also did you have to return the pre-tax amounts or the post-tax amounts?
      - joshuamorton 8y ago
        I stayed beyond one year, so idk. But I'd expect pre-tax. Obviously you wouldn't pay tax on the amount you return, so it's not really an important distinction.
        Hydraulix989 8y ago
        Typically, the company withholds the tax for you though. I've heard stories of companies demanding the pre-tax amounts even though THEY "paid" your tax already by withholding it.
        joshuamorton 8y ago
        That makes sense to me. The company can't unpay your taxes for you, you need to do that (and there are many options to do that, which vary from underpaying your next estimated taxes[1] to just waiting for a larger than normal refund). And if I recall, if your income increases a significant amount, you aren't penalized for underpaying estimated taxes, so there's ways to "protect" yourself (and also to not overpay). But making your taxes correct is your responsibility, not your employers. Why would your company reimburse you for taxes that you don't owe? [1]: For example, when I was interning, the "trick" was to set yourself as having some large number of dependents in the payroll tool. The tools assumed a year long employment, but as a fixed-term employee, you would owe significantly fewer taxes than the estimation. Careful massaging of the number of dependents was a knob you could turn to make your estimated taxes more in line with your actual taxes. This was, according to people I asked, legal as long as it wasn't being done fraudulently.
somethingsimple 8y ago
Sort of tangential, but what was work/life balance like at Google for you?
byebyetech 8y ago
Even working at Google just for 8 months was a resume booster? Don't they ask you why you left in such a short time?
- kcorbitt 8y ago
  1. In everyday conversation, it doesn't come up. Not that I hide the fact that I left early, but the natural conversation usually goes "when I was working at Google ..." not "When I was working at Google, which I left after only 8 months, ..." 2. Sometimes it does come up (including while interviewing for my current job), and someone will ask me why I left so soon. I just tell the truth, which is that I liked my coworkers and the perks but didn't particularly enjoy the big-company atmosphere. Most people I talk to working in startups can identify with that and don't hold it against me. Of course, if I had a string of several companies that I worked at for less than a year each, I'm sure that would be interpreted differently. But that's not the case.

Hydraulix989 8y ago

Did you have to return any signing bonuses, relocation, etc in full?

kcorbitt 8y ago
I had to return a prorated portion of my signing bonus and relocation expenses. The larger financial hit was that none of my RSUs had vested, so I walked away from those entirely (my understanding is that Google has since changed their policy and RSUs now begin vesting immediately). To be clear, I don't recommend that anyone join Google with the intention of leaving in less than a year. Even though I wasn't particularly enjoying myself, I was planning on staying for ~18 months to pay back Google's investment in my training. In the end though I changed my mind and left earlier because an opportunity came up that was simply too good to refuse.
- joshuamorton 8y ago
  This is correct. You'll still repost prorated signing and relo, but some of your stock will have vested.
  - Hydraulix989 8y ago
    Surprised there is no one-year cliff now. Also did you have to return the pre-tax amounts or the post-tax amounts?
    - joshuamorton 8y ago
      I stayed beyond one year, so idk. But I'd expect pre-tax. Obviously you wouldn't pay tax on the amount you return, so it's not really an important distinction.
      - Hydraulix989 8y ago
        Typically, the company withholds the tax for you though. I've heard stories of companies demanding the pre-tax amounts even though THEY "paid" your tax already by withholding it.
        joshuamorton 8y ago
        That makes sense to me. The company can't unpay your taxes for you, you need to do that (and there are many options to do that, which vary from underpaying your next estimated taxes[1] to just waiting for a larger than normal refund). And if I recall, if your income increases a significant amount, you aren't penalized for underpaying estimated taxes, so there's ways to "protect" yourself (and also to not overpay). But making your taxes correct is your responsibility, not your employers. Why would your company reimburse you for taxes that you don't owe? [1]: For example, when I was interning, the "trick" was to set yourself as having some large number of dependents in the payroll tool. The tools assumed a year long employment, but as a fixed-term employee, you would owe significantly fewer taxes than the estimation. Careful massaging of the number of dependents was a knob you could turn to make your estimated taxes more in line with your actual taxes. This was, according to people I asked, legal as long as it wasn't being done fraudulently.

somethingsimple 8y ago

Sort of tangential, but what was work/life balance like at Google for you?

byebyetech 8y ago

Even working at Google just for 8 months was a resume booster? Don't they ask you why you left in such a short time?

kcorbitt 8y ago
1. In everyday conversation, it doesn't come up. Not that I hide the fact that I left early, but the natural conversation usually goes "when I was working at Google ..." not "When I was working at Google, which I left after only 8 months, ..." 2. Sometimes it does come up (including while interviewing for my current job), and someone will ask me why I left so soon. I just tell the truth, which is that I liked my coworkers and the perks but didn't particularly enjoy the big-company atmosphere. Most people I talk to working in startups can identify with that and don't hold it against me. Of course, if I had a string of several companies that I worked at for less than a year each, I'm sure that would be interpreted differently. But that's not the case.