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As a mainframer: IBM should make the z/OS available for free experimentation! That's the biggest obstacle and reason why people do not know it. Even the long d

by js8 8y ago

As a mainframer: IBM should make the z/OS available for free experimentation! That's the biggest obstacle and reason why people do not know it. Even the long dead Solaris has more hackers on it than z/OS. Also, millenials will also want job security and pensions, eventually. Just wait when they have kids.

sithadmin 8y ago
Even if Z/OS was available for free, wouldn't hardware be a huge problem? IBM zSeries are pretty unique under the hood.
- js8 8y ago
  IBM has an emulator as part of zPDT, and there is also Hercules emulator for free. It's a problem for certain things (like sysplex programming or HMC), but mostly easy to deal with.
nwhatt 8y ago
Is that what is behind the Master the mainframe program? https://www.ibm.com/it-infrastructure/z/education/master-the-mainframe https://www.ibm.com/it-infrastructure/z/education/master-the...
- kkarakk 8y ago
  link is down, doesn't work
lovich 8y ago
As a millennial I took a pass on mainframe jobs, even though I find mainframes interesting, precisely because of job security. Companies are not going to change their culture overnight, and they currently view employees as disposable. There's not many jobs in mainframe developer compared to say web dev, and the skills in mainframe developer to seem like they transfer poorly. I have a better chance at keeping the actual day to day of my life stable if I keep skills in an industry where I have lots of opportunities for jobs. Unless companies employing mainframe developer start offering garunteed pensions that are funded up front or a much higher average salary than the alternatives, it's not a gamble I'd be willing to take Edit: additionally the mainframe engineer talent pool seems to skew much older than other development. That wouldn't be a problem if the field was growing. Having a decent chance of always being the new guy or junior even if you've been there 10+ years would probably do little for job satisfaction given how many people automatically defer to seniority. I have no real interest in having my ideas ignored for years
- js8 8y ago
  There are advantages and disadvantages to mainframe specialization. Because it's a stable thing for big companies, there is actually more job security than in other areas of IT. Big companies need to keep these systems running, somehow; they are more open to training people from the outside, and they are willing to pay for expertise. There is an evolutionary balance. You also say that you would like the field you select to be growing. Selecting a growing field can be more risky, too. Things that are already widely adopted are probably proven to work really well, and therefore they are there to stay for a while. As for the older people in the industry, I have always enjoyed it. Compared to young people, older people are generally more calm and less needy to prove themselves than young people. They actually understand (and demand from the company) the work-life balance better. And they have more interesting stories to tell. The truth is lot of smart people worked on the mainframe in the past, and often the most successful stayed in the business. The fear that innovation gets ignored - well, that is partly unfounded. It's true that mainframe is supposed to be super stable platform (it's a philosophical difference), so you only change things in production when needed. But in tooling, you can innovate a lot. I work for one of the mainframe companies mentioned in the article, but I am not American. In our office, there is plenty of young people and some of them do really good innovation, like for example writing some Python or JS tools. Usually, the older people are impressed by that, as long as it brings some practical value.

by js8 8y ago

sithadmin 8y ago

Even if Z/OS was available for free, wouldn't hardware be a huge problem? IBM zSeries are pretty unique under the hood.

js8 8y ago
IBM has an emulator as part of zPDT, and there is also Hercules emulator for free. It's a problem for certain things (like sysplex programming or HMC), but mostly easy to deal with.

nwhatt 8y ago

Is that what is behind the Master the mainframe program? https://www.ibm.com/it-infrastructure/z/education/master-the-mainframe https://www.ibm.com/it-infrastructure/z/education/master-the...

kkarakk 8y ago
link is down, doesn't work

lovich 8y ago

As a millennial I took a pass on mainframe jobs, even though I find mainframes interesting, precisely because of job security. Companies are not going to change their culture overnight, and they currently view employees as disposable. There's not many jobs in mainframe developer compared to say web dev, and the skills in mainframe developer to seem like they transfer poorly. I have a better chance at keeping the actual day to day of my life stable if I keep skills in an industry where I have lots of opportunities for jobs. Unless companies employing mainframe developer start offering garunteed pensions that are funded up front or a much higher average salary than the alternatives, it's not a gamble I'd be willing to take Edit: additionally the mainframe engineer talent pool seems to skew much older than other development. That wouldn't be a problem if the field was growing. Having a decent chance of always being the new guy or junior even if you've been there 10+ years would probably do little for job satisfaction given how many people automatically defer to seniority. I have no real interest in having my ideas ignored for years

js8 8y ago
There are advantages and disadvantages to mainframe specialization. Because it's a stable thing for big companies, there is actually more job security than in other areas of IT. Big companies need to keep these systems running, somehow; they are more open to training people from the outside, and they are willing to pay for expertise. There is an evolutionary balance. You also say that you would like the field you select to be growing. Selecting a growing field can be more risky, too. Things that are already widely adopted are probably proven to work really well, and therefore they are there to stay for a while. As for the older people in the industry, I have always enjoyed it. Compared to young people, older people are generally more calm and less needy to prove themselves than young people. They actually understand (and demand from the company) the work-life balance better. And they have more interesting stories to tell. The truth is lot of smart people worked on the mainframe in the past, and often the most successful stayed in the business. The fear that innovation gets ignored - well, that is partly unfounded. It's true that mainframe is supposed to be super stable platform (it's a philosophical difference), so you only change things in production when needed. But in tooling, you can innovate a lot. I work for one of the mainframe companies mentioned in the article, but I am not American. In our office, there is plenty of young people and some of them do really good innovation, like for example writing some Python or JS tools. Usually, the older people are impressed by that, as long as it brings some practical value.